Snobbery

[railnutter]

Now on my second Skoda , a Superb Sportline that replaced a Yeti. The Yeti  replaced a top of the range Land Rover Discovery that has to be the worst car I have ever had. Kept it less than a year , lost a fortune, constantly going wrong including the engine blowing up "yeh" said the guy from Land Rover "thats a common fault, I will fit a new engine but it could happen again tomorow" . Both the yeti and this new Superb seem to be faultless. So Badge snobery has no place. Just buy what works for you.

[Ashmount]

I think you have hit on something in your uncle saying "for that kind of money I would have chosen something else". 

Skoda has built a reputation for a lot of car, (giving the Audi/BMW/Merc a challenge on quality and spec) but for way less money.

It was certainly the case when I bought my SII Elegance DSG 4x4 in 2011 and came away from Merc. I felt no loss in quality but a hefty bulge in my wallet. There was a mindset among some friends that, you wouldn't be driving a Skoda if you could afford 'better'. A few were appreciative of the car, but just flat out said they couldn't drive the badge. They all though buying a Superb  was probably an aberration and I would get over it.

 

Now six years later after driving the best car I ever owned I moved into a 3 month old Sportline. The OTR price of this car with metallic paint is around £38,000 (which I appreciate no-one pays), but the value proposition argument is fast falling away. As they say its not the price of the car its the cost to change and with PCH and PCP deals being written to suit the customer, this has a big bearing too. 

 

So, nowI see a different set of behaviour from those with badge loyalty (I won't call them snobs). The Superb is recognised among my friends as a great car, but their thinkings is 'you could have had a Audi/Merc/BMW for that kind of money'.

 

And the truth is I could...but didn't.

Ash

 

 

[S00perb]

My Superbs are the best cars I have ever had, offer me a lexus, audi, merc, BMW - nope - I want my Skoda Superbs. I think the badge snobbery is to our advantage. Keeps the price low

[freelunch]

Maybe, driving a Škoda is reverse snobbery? 

 

Every other car in my neighbourhood is Audi/BMW/Merc. I am happy to drive something different. I chose an Alfa Romeo Brera, despite being warned over the Italian electrics, because it was different (and beautiful). It never let me down in three years.

 

And so, I chose a Škoda. Trouble is, I'm starting to notice the badge/grill all over the place! 

 

(Not that many Sportlines, mind, so I guess I'm still okay.)

[IJWS15]

While the VFM of a 38k Superb has to be questioned - the Skodas strength is a good, well specced, reliable car for the money if you stay lower/middle range.  26k ish for a 2.0 TDI 150 SEL Exec gets you more than you would have on a merc or an audi 10k more with similar quality levels.

 

What I still find hilarious is the Audi badge snobs - their Audis have Skoda badges on lots of parts along with the VW and Seat badges! 

[philsmith]

Quote

While the VFM of a 38k Superb has to be questioned

 

My 280 had a list price of over 38K, although I did pay less than this with some discounting. I bought it after 15 years of E class ownership (3 cars) if I had bought an equivalent specced Mercedes it would have been well over 50K and I would not of got 4x4 or a high performance engine.

I think that buying a fully optioned E class is what has to be questioned, the Superb is a bargain compared, and to my mind as good as if not better in some areas (comfort for one).

Also configured a Passat with the same options at the time of purchase two years ago and it was 10K dearer for what is essentially the same car and you couldn't even get one with a proper petrol engine!

 

Also my car has been absolutely perfect with no faults whatsoever.

Edited 2 October, 2017 by philsmith

[witmann]

22 hours ago, Ashmount said:

'you could have had a Audi/Merc/BMW for that kind of money'.

And the truth is I could...but didn't.

Exactly - I could, but after comparing Superb to other brands I realized that it gives me a package that suits my needs best: a nice looking, comfortable car for long trips with a snippy engine and large boot opening.

"Premium" brands competitors cab be bought for similar money, but they will have less powerful engines and much less equipment. Also some of them are not that much better in terms of feeling or quality.

BMW 3 Series - poor sound insulation, interior feels "normal", suspension is not that comfortable

Merc C class - that central console cracks like my grandma's old sofa.

Alfa Romeo Giulia - great car, drives like mad, pretty interior, but it's offered as saloon only.

Lexus IS - same as Alfa - great looking and feeling car, nice engine (with big fuel appetite though), but saloon only.

"Standard" brands competitors are more reasonable choices, but most of them somehow fall behind the Superb (in my opinion and for my needs of course).

Ford Mondeo - old, dated, plasticky interior, dated infotainment, too heavy

Mazda 6 - beautiful exterior, nice looking interior with cheap materials here and there, engines without turbo, lacks in noise insulation

Opel/Vauxhall Insignia - nice car, cool gadgets, nice interior, hatchback (BIG pro), a tad limited engine offering (there's a big gap between 1.5 165 BHP and 2.0 260 BHP), slow automatic gearbox means that the most powerful engine goes like a weaker 220 TSI in Skoda despite having more power

Kia Optima - nice car, great engine (2.0 245 BHP), nice interior, but looks good only as a saloon and I need a large opening.

VW Passat - same tech as Superb, less interesting interior, overall a very dull car with a bit better quality than Superb.

VW Arteon - great looking car, same tech as Superb, it basically is a bit more "premium" Superb in regard to all features, but is a tad too expensive.

 

If your new car needs to meet some specific requirements it's not that easy to find the right one unfortunately.

[Mickey43]

58 minutes ago, IJWS15 said:

While the VFM of a 38k Superb has to be questioned - the Skodas strength is a good, well specced, reliable car for the money if you stay lower/middle range.  26k ish for a 2.0 TDI 150 SEL Exec gets you more than you would have on a merc or an audi 10k more with similar quality levels.

 

What I still find hilarious is the Audi badge snobs - their Audis have Skoda badges on lots of parts along with the VW and Seat badges! 

Wouldn't pay 38k for a Superb or any car for that matter.

I had an Audi A6 S-line previously, looked at them again when renewing but fancied a change.  A6 was a nice car but nothing exceptional, and a few things were starting to wrong around 70k miles.  (brake pad sensors went, water pump went, coolant leak, timing belt went).

 

I got a 6 month old Superb L&K for £26k with only 700 miles on the clock (ex demo).  Extras  included were 19" wheels, metallic paint, boot liner.

 

For that money I would be just about getting into a year old bog basic Audi A6 SE with about 5000 miles on.  An A6 specced similar to what I have in the Skoda would be up in the mid-£40k's I would say.

Badge snobs will always be badge snobs, just enjoy the car.

 

 

 

 

Edited 2 October, 2017 by Mickey43

[YTT]

Having owned a number of 'premium' cars (including a top-of-the-range Jag XF S, two Merc E55AMG's, a Merc CLS500 and currently an Audi TTRS), you should see the look of horror I get off people when I tell them I just ordered a new Skoda Superb to replace the TTRS!

As far as I'm concerned, it's the car industry's best kept secret. I don't feel embarrassed, I feel smug. Having ordered a new 280 L&K with just about every option available, I'm getting a lot more car for a lot less money than a Audi / BMW / Merc. You can freeze on a cold winters morning. I'll put on my heated front seats. And heated rear seats. And rear screen. And front screen. And heated washer nozzles. And heated steering wheel. I could go on and on with all the other features. I'd rather have these than a level of  unquantifiable 'niceness' or a race track handling ability that I'll never use.

You can, of course, get these features in the 'premium' brands. But once you start adding options, the price goes through the roof. It winds me up when I see reviews that say something to the effect that 'the Superb is a great car, but I'd choose an Audi A4'. Trouble is, you can't have one, not at the same spec / price. I've spent a month doing the rounds at dealers, test driving, negotiating etc. I couldn't get a 'premium' brand at anything close to the deal I got on the L&K, from a main dealer. I've read some people saying Skoda's prices have crept up too high. But the reality is you can get a deal on a Skoda that is much better than some others. I was stunned at the price I got mine for.

And it's not about affordability. I can afford a Rolls Royce. It's about value for money.

I'm lucky enough to have a lot of experience of 'premium' brands over many years and frankly, they're not worth it. You pay 25-50% more, but you don't get 25-50% more. I've done my time on the badge snobbery roundabout. And all my 'premium' cars developed rattles here and there after a while. What, do you think they don't?! And they all needed expensive repairs at some point and servicing costs were horrendous.

I test drove the Superb and loved it. When I get mine, I'm expecting it to be not quite as good a ride as some other cars I've had. Nor as fast. Nor as 'nice'. But there's a different between 'not quite as good' and 'bad'. It's good enough for me and in the real world there are few occasions when the 'premium' brand advantage actually means anything on the road.

And perhaps more than anything, I just enjoyed driving it more than the others I tried.

So back on topic, when I see an Audi / BMW / Merc now, I smugly think my new Suberb will be bigger, faster, better equipped and more enjoyable, for a lot less money. Which I guess is Skoda brand snobbery.

 

[philsmith]

Quote

When I get mine, I'm expecting it to be not quite as good a ride as some other cars I've had.

 

Coming from three E class mercs in the last fifteen years I must say that the ride is much better than any of them, including one that had the air suspension option!

 

That car btw, was a full loaded car with every single available option fitted, I bought it at 2 years old in 2008 but had the original invoice for it,  £52K in 2006! Wouldn't like to think how much a fully loaded E class would cost now but I do know I have as many if not more options on my Superb than that car had.

[YTT]

I can believe that Phil. I'm just erring on the side of pessimism! Fact is, I meant to take note of the handling when I test drove the car (because it's the only negative you ever read in some reviews), but I forgot. It was only later that I remembered.  The very fact that nothing about the handling caught my attention when driving it pretty much says it all. There was nothing to notice. It was fine. And that was through a good mix of A, B and dual carriageway roads. I daresay a BMW M series would be better round a track, but I'm not intending to drive it round a track!

[rtj70]

When I had the SE L Exec as a 220PS petrol for a week I never found it lacking. Throttle response was poor compared to my Audi 1.4TFSI mind.

 

Because I had it for a week I swapped between the A3 and Superb a lot for journeys. Both are MQB based cars with the same engine and gearbox...

 

I did some short motorway journeys but little which was a regret. But I had a Passat and tried out ACC in that for a long journey.

 

These are good cars IMO.

[philsmith]

Quote

I daresay a BMW M series would be better round a track, but I'm not intending to drive it round a track!

 

I would normally say that but I have some laps of Nurburgring booked at the end of the month!

Not intending to go crazy, I am not a good enough driver for that, but should be interesting to see how it handles, in sport mode of course don't think I'll go around in comfort!

[eurotraveller]

Hmmm…

Doing the ‘Ring can be either a nice drive in the country or a serious test of man and machine.

In a Superb, it had better be approached as the former. I cannot imagine the car being anything other than hopeless and in fact scary if pushed seriously on that track (or any other). Floating around in an unsupportive seat without a proper harness while trying to control a car that is itself floating around like a barge? Not for me, thanks.

Meanwhile, expect massive wear of brakes and tyres.

As for the topic here: couldn’t agree more with YTT. We come from the same place and have the same outlook. Skoda snobbery is fun.

 

[YTT]

An expectation that the Superb wouldn't be so good at Nurburgring. Wouldn't it be funny if it did ok. Let us know....

[YTT]

Quick YouTube search - I'm not an expert at older Superb models, so I don't know if this is a Series 2 or 3. Seems to be doing alright.

 

 

[Penpusher]

1 hour ago, philsmith said:

 

I would normally say that but I have some laps of Nurburgring booked at the end of the month!

Not intending to go crazy, I am not a good enough driver for that, but should be interesting to see how it handles, in sport mode of course don't think I'll go around in comfort!

Have you checked your insurance as most UK insurance companies exclude the Nürburgring.  As it's a public road, I think they still have to cover third party risks, but can then seek to recover their payout from you., though I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong.

 

I'm on my fourth Škoda, have travelled all over Europe in them and have been past Nürburgring several times but I never wanted to drive around it.  I'm not at all against anyone doing it as we all like different things, but it's not for me.  Even on the autobahn in Germany or on Polish motorways where the limit is 140 kph, I always travel at about 70-80 mph, relax, enjoy the scenery and OK, I arrive a little later than if I'd driven faster but I'm not highly tensed after battling with BMWs Audis and the like in the fast lane.

 

Back on topic, I don't care what the badge is on my car, as long as I'm happy with my car.  A colleague at work won't buy a car unless it has a German manufacturer's badge on the front (he's currently driving a Mercedes) and recommends anyone else does the same.  If anyone has a German car or if he sees one on the road, he can tell you the exact model and specification, but can't even remember what make of car other staff drive if it's non-German.  

 

We hired an Audi A3 in Spain back in April when we went on holiday (it was only a week and so it was too far to drive from the UK in that short time) and quality wise I found it similar to the  Škoda and I can't say it was noticeably better.  The only thing I didn't like was visibility at junctions.  I think as it was the 5 door model and originally it was only designed with 3 doors, the pillar between the front and rear doors was too far forward.  I'm tall and have the seat well back and junctions, particularly if they're at an angle, had to be taken with great care.

[philsmith]

As I said I am not goint to go crazy, just want to drive around the circuit to say I have, it's a tourist day not a track test day so plenty of camper vans etc going around.

Will drive a bit briskly but will not go mad as I said, anyway, I am a crap driver so no point in venturing outside my comfort zone.

[CWARD]

Tourist day with plenty of camper van's like these 

 

 

[philsmith]

I shall tuck in behind one of the bigger ones and save some petrol.

[U241170]

3 hours ago, CWARD said:

Tourist day with plenty of camper van's like these 

 

 

 add o more guy with a big loaded truck and all is perfect. :))))

[Prykey]

On 10/4/2017 at 17:38, philsmith said:

I shall tuck in behind one of the bigger ones and save some petrol.

 

Stay on the right hand side of the track and take it easy, the fast guys will overtake on the left, best advice is not to get involved in someone else's accident 

[YTT]

Well I finally picked up my new 280 L&K last weekend, just under 7 weeks delivery time. It's early days, but so far I'm very impressed. It's smooth, quiet, comfortable and has a real quality feel to it. Performance is great, although I'm limited by running-in at the moment. But what's really blown me away is the tech. Not just the gadget count, but the fact that someone at Skoda has clearly put a lot of thought into it - really useable. It's a joy to drive. Best I've ever had.

Going back to earlier comments about pricing, I got mine for £31200, including my rusty, knackered old 1997 Mitsubishi L200 diesel truck (worth about £500) on the Skoda scrappage scheme. That's the 280 L&K hatch, every option bar the sunroof, 5 year extended warranty, 2 year service plan and Autoglym treatment inside and out. Plus boot liner, mudflaps and bumper protector. The Audi / BMW / Merc dealers I spoke to wouldn't take the truck, has to be a passenger car. But Skoda do. So when I hear 'you can get a equivalent BMW for the price of the Superb 280', errr no you can't. Not even nearly.

Just before I sold my TTRS  last week I got it serviced and they gave me a loan Audi A5. What a god-awful car that was. I priced it out at £51k on the Audi configurator in the same spec as my Superb. You couldn't of given it away to me.

[rtj70]

Glad you like it.

 

Was the A5 the current model or the previous? I ask because I had the A3 saloon in 2014 and the interior design and quality seemed better than the A4/A5 model at the time. They moved on from that though. I have to say the Superb is a very nice car - although a lot of the switch gear is not up to Audi quality, even the humble window switch is cheap plastic. But I'm not complaining! I'd rather a few cheap bits and then a lot of the options that would cost a lot on a VW and especially Audi.

 

Sounds like you got a good deal. List price on my Superb SE L Business 1.4TSI DSG with options was £30,500. Not that the lease company paid that.

[Crassus]

Although the popularity of ŠKODA is growing, the brand still has a perception problem. Many ignorant people think it’s a poor an choice like Lada. Little do they know that ŠKODA use the same technology and components as VW, Audi and SEAT. The only true poor mans automotive  brand in the U.K. is Dacia.

 

When we were looking for a hatchback as a second car, my badge snob for a girlfriend, wanted none of it when I suggested that we check out ŠKODA. It took a lot of convincing to get her into the dealership but once she had a closer look and a test drive she was won over, and loves the design of our white Fabia colour edition.

 

The Kodiaq and Karoq will be big ambassadors of the brand and get many new curious customers in through the door. Other than that I think the Superb is an excellent flagship model and is a fantastic alternative to the pricey Passat.