dsg boxes

[cjb]

My Leon DSG PD140 (so the same engine/box as an Octy- 6 speed wet DSG) has been completely reliable for the last 2 years/30k miles. It's excellent. The change can get a bit clunkier is it gets VERY hot in a lot of almost-standstill traffic, but otherwise it's sommoth, fast, and about as economical as a manual.

[cjb]

Dare I suggest that I have been astounded as to how well the DSG has behaved/held the gears in snow,

I have had absolutly NO problems with spinning or overreving and running away up through the gears.

Quite astounding.

I mostly drive in heavy boots but with a light right foot.

I have now changed the Bridgestones for a set of Continental TS830 winter tyres ( snowflake marked)

Which seem to be much better.

Which way to Everest again?

Cheers

M

+1.

[topcat2006]

I like the box and it is the second vw dsg I have had. The first was on a T5 and it let go at 100,000 miles and cost £6k for a recon box from vw.

I must admit I would prefer a Merc box over the DSG - previous to the Skoda I had a vito 120cdi with the 5 speed box and that was so smooth and so quick on a level that the dsg box will never be.

I have snow tyres and not a problem in the snow - although again not as good as the Merc box - but then it was rear wheel drive too and my personal preference is for rwd with a load on the back in snow. A lot more predictable.

Would I have another one - yes but only if I could not afford to buy a merc S or E class next.........

Tom

[Matt Bodycombe]

nice to drive but a bit uninvolving and I dn't like the hesitatiion that sometimes happens moving away from rest of from junctions. I also won't hold in D without throttle unlike a conventional auto (unless you have hill start) so have to get on the gas before releasing handbrake. It is really smooth and imperceptible on the go: S or rather rev the nuts of it mode rather pointless

I'd imagine the DSG wouldn't be that much fun in the snow however but what auto is.

Edited 18 December, 2010 by Matt Bodycombe

[Spudhoolio]

I am very happy with my DSG.

I will sell the car when it's 3 years old or take out an extended warranty.

The cost of out of warranty repairs to the DSG is horrendous.

[dunc69]

When considering dry conditions vs snow / ice, I'd say tyre choice is more important than which 'box you have.

My Golf GTI DSG on PS2s was hopeless in the snow, but my DSG Octy seems much better (so far!) on Contis.

Overall, love the DSG 'box and will probably stick with dual clutch boxes from now on, unless / until something better comes along!

Edited 18 December, 2010 by dunc69

[Interphase]

but if you decide to accelarate all of a sudden (as you do at roundabouts) it has to deselect 2nd and select 4th. And that takes a bit of time.

I thought the DSG had one clutch handling the shaft with the odd gears, and one dealing with the evens, so it effectively has the next gear ready for you no matter which way you go?

[jrw]

I thought the DSG had one clutch handling the shaft with the odd gears, and one dealing with the evens, so it effectively has the next gear ready for you no matter which way you go?

How could that possibly work unless you have 4 clutches? If you were travelling in 3rd accelerating it would have 4th ready on the other clutch but then you need to slow down, it will then have to change that clutch to 2nd and then move from the clutch in 3rd gear to the one which is then in 2nd.

My DSG is great in this snow with my Avon Ice Touring tyres on it. Only problem is all the other road users on their summer tyres doing 10mph with no windows or lights cleared and their lights switched off.

[marcusthehat]

2 clutches and a functioning (electronic) brain, the car "knows" the gradient, and about every other possible bit of information, except what lies ahead.

So if accelerating it pre-picks the next highest gear

& if slowing the next lowest.

Simplistically each clutch is used in turn, therefore there has to be a "split second" of time available to pick the best next gear, on the other clutch, either up or down.

Simples (not)

But it works

[Hauptmann]

The DSG is really a modern variation on the famous Wilson pre-selector gearbox. Its basically two gearboxes in one - with one gearbox operating on the 'odd' ratios and the other on the 'even' ratios. A computer decides which gearbox to use via engagement of the appropriate clutch.

The computer has to predict which gear is going to be used next, based on engine and vehicle speed and load, and the immediate history of speed and load. Most of the time it will guess right and pre-select the correct gear and everything goes to plan. Sometimes it will guess wrong and the gearbox is caught out - e.g. if the driver accelerates, and then hesitates, or sometimes when accelerating, braking, accelerating, as when negotiating a roundabout.

Like any auto it can't predict the road ahead (i.e. it has feedback, but not feedforward) and so unless you are prepared to use the manual over-ride you have some loss of control in certain circumstances. That's why I'm not keen on them. I'm also not keen on expensive failures (US VW/Audi owners going for a Class Action on basis of frequency and cost of out-of-warranty failures).

[lol-lol]

The 7 speed, on the 1.8 TSI, gives better fuel consumption and lower emissions than the manual and is brilliant in traffic.

Do not expect any problems although I do wonder when VAG is going to up their warranty from 60K to 100K miles like many other manufactures are doing.

I found the £140 servicing at 40K a bit of a hit on the 6 speed box, so the 7 speed scores here as well as the fuel consumption.

To get the best out of it, fuel consumption wise, as a previous writer has said, one needs to use eyes and brain to use tiptronic function to push in to higher gear, or neutral, if the road ahead warrants it. If there is a long down hill gradient ahead, quite road, then pushing the box in to 7 th or neutral can improve by 2 or 3 mpg the fuel consumption.

So DSG, yes marvelous, even better if driven thoughtfully, 7 speed even better than 6 but means you have to have the sub 250 Nm torque engine but that is no problem with 1.4 TSI 180 hp or 1.8 TSI as well fast and pleasurable to drive.

Edited 19 December, 2010 by lol

[r6ymy]

I wasn't planning to buy an auto, had a test drive in a 1.4TSI DSG as I wanted to see if the 1.4 would be powerful enough, and that was all that was available as a demonstrator. Was really impressed by the combination so that's what I bought. The DSG gearbox has been fantastic so far, with almost imperceptible gear changes, and the economy is fantastic. It does sometimes want to change into 7th a little too early though, also very occasionally notice a lag when I've slowed down for a junction or roundabout, but it's improved. Not sure whether that's the gearbox's fuzzy logic, or me adapting to the best way to drive it.

Disagree with comments about it being good in snow though. It's fine once you've got moving, but pulling away from a standstill is dodgy if there is even a slight gradient or slightly deeper snow, I got stuck a couple of times last night trying to cross juctions in about 4" of snow, and today in a car park on a very slight slope, just wouldn't get traction now matter how careful I was, had to reverse out in the end. Previous car was a Focus and that was much easier to drive in the snow earlier this year. Even the Mazda RX8 I had before that was easier in the snow.

Edited 19 December, 2010 by r6ymy

[themacster]

I've recently converted to a 7 speed dsg after 33 years of manuals. It has taken a little time to get used to it - you need to keep your left foot away from the pedals or you might stamp on the brake as if it was the clutch if your concentration goes. Getting used to it now and generally love it - I do a lot of stop/start driving and its so nice not to have the chore of manual gearchanges all the time. I still prefer the controllability of a manual in slow speed manouevres, but this is outweighed by the benefit the rest of the time. Not had any problems yet in the snow and ice, but I would again still be more comfortable with a manual box in these circumstances. If you need the box for medical reasons, you won't be disappointed

[Evening Star]

When it comes to slow speed manoeuvres, such as reversing into a parking space or slow U turn, I just let the engine do the work, much easier.

[RSIT]

My VRS diesel just had the pressure plate replaced(if wrong some expert on here will correct me) when cold there would be funny noise till car heated 85,000 miles on it be two years old next month Skoda replaced it under warranty.

As for the snow driving rather have it that the manual but i turn off the traction control in case I need to steer out of sideways in a hurry.

Edited 20 December, 2010 by RSIT

[Lynnster]

Can't comment on reliability as I've only had mine 10 weeks and 2500 miles.

I have a love-hate relationship with it! The technology is simply amazing! I love the easy driving style and imperceptible changes. You can accelerate hard without passengers getting thrown forward as you change gear. The hill hold is wonderful - take your foot off the brake and the brakes are held on up to 2 seconds while you press the throttle. Drove SWMBO's manual Micra through rush hour Leeds ring road traffic last week and I yearned for the ease of the auto.

But sometimes I hate it! I admit that much of it is down to me. I still haven't got into the habit of driving an automatic - after 35yrs driving manuals (except for a few hire cars) I have to think about what I am doing as it hasn't become 2nd nature yet - especially when moving off, shutting down and performing low speed manoevres. I had a "moment" at some lights yesterday - waiting in N, lights changed, forgot to select D :S rolled forward VERY slowly not fast enough to select drive without having to touch the brake - the woman behind was not impressed!

I also hate the hesitation when you roll up with foot off the throttle to a junction or roundabout; the DSG hangs on to high gears in this situation 3 or even 4; before you stop you see a gap, press the throttle, wait as the gap shrinks while the DSG decides which gear to use, press the throttle harder cos you ain't moving then leap forward with wheels spinning as it kicks down into 1st and takes off like a scalded cat. In reality the hesitation is probably no longer than it would take me to change 3rd to 2nd but it just seems like a lifetime!

I find it very easy to start off gently by using the anti-stall to trickle along and then gently apply throttle; and very easy to set off briskly. The difficulty is getting the throttle balance for all points in between. I also miss the involvement when driving briskly along the B roads.

Do I regret buying this car? - definitely not.

On balance will my next car be a DSG? Hmmm... Jury's out... Maybe... Around 60:40 in favour I suppose... but what holiday or tasty extras could I get with the £1500 price difference... make it 50:50!

[Lynnster]

I have had an Octavia, bought new, since late August and I concur totally with your assessment of the DSG gearbox, However I have been driving automatic boxes for almost 15 years (is there anyother way to drive?) and believe the hesitation from rest is not one you will get used to. I think this is a glitch in the design or programming which results, on occassions, with the car taking off " like a bat out of hell" Dont believe it is something I will get used to as it is intermittent and impossible to anticipate.

Apart of this the box is superb with seamless changes and great for overtaking, even if the turbo lag can be disconcerting. Will I buy one again? Probably but hope that by then this minor problem will have been sorted.

[Spudhoolio]

The DSG box certainly does require a bit of finesse from your right foot.

To avoid the "bat out of hell" syndrome from stationary, when selecting D from N, I always wait a second and feel for the clutches to engage before pressing the GO! pedal.

The system seems uncertain what to do when Zig-zagging through roundabouts. Maybe need to drop down a cog using the paddles.

My 6G wet DSG box seems to be a bit less smooth in this cold weather, maybe something to do with oil viscosity ?

Turbo lag ? what's that ? Never noticed it

I do feel that the DSG hangs on to the revs too much when accelerating hard, seems to go well past the peak torque.

Edited 20 December, 2010 by Spudhoolio

[M12MKD]

I cannot comment on driving in the snow this year as I've tucked the Octavia up until Jan. My uncle said he's has been fine in the snow, only getting semi-stuck on one hill that most cars seem to struggle with.

With the whole snow thing last year I found that just letting the brake off and build up speed was the best way to pull away.

[eccleshill]

The DSG box certainly does require a bit of finesse from your right foot.

To avoid the "bat out of hell" syndrome from stationary, when selecting D from N, I always wait a second and feel for the clutches to engage before pressing the GO! pedal.

I have driven both and the key difference between the wet clutch 6 speed and the dry clutch 7 speed is that you get absolutely zero clutch drag with the 7 speed. When you engage D from N you feel nothing at all - no drop in revs, no lurch, nothing!

I did say in my post that I thought that my issues with the DSG box were mostly down to me and I still think that to be true. I operate a manual gearbox as second nature so it will take a while to get to the same level with any auto. As you rightly say I still need to develop that right foot finesse and am beginning to realise how over the years I have got into the bad habit of dipping the clutch during low speed manoeuvres.

The hesitation tends to be worse when driving gently; if traffic conditions allow a slightly more "aggressive" style then the hesitation goes away. Some have suggested switching to Tiptronic mode to overcome it - I have tried that and it is OK but in fact have found that the best way for me on approach to the roundabout or junction is to select S mode then as I accelerate into the traffic flow just nudge it back into D.

Does anyone else find the Tiptronic mode counter-intuitive? I don't know why but it seems natural to me to pull the lever back to change up and push forward to change down - but it is the other way around. Is that just me?