Murdering barsteward s

[DaKKs_152]

I'll simply say not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists are Muslim.

Oklahoma....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_bombing

[devonutopia]

and Oslo massacre bloke,

[Dark_Hero]

Can't say I've heard of them. But I've calmed down a bit now and thinking clearly

[karlbar2k]

Britain as a nation has been subjected to terror attacks for decades. This is just a tactic that is the most basic but gets huge coverage.

As for the comment about all terrorists being Muslim, the largest proportion of deaths in the UK as the result of terror attacks comes from the IRA and last time I checked there werent too many Muslims there?

As with all things, my thoughts go out to the family of the deceased

[threadbear]

Reality is far more shocking than anything on a film. A traumatic day for London and everyone concerned. Not just the police but dont forget the paramedics and doctors on scene.

[gallego1968]

It makes me so angry that people who live in this country do stuff like that. If you don't agree with what we do then go to the country that does. This is a prime example why we need to bring bag the death penalty.

[D15VRS]

AlphaPapa, I made the comment White English Catholic, as to prove that people with their own beliefs are not all Morons, All these below have been named and possibly more to come, you cannot justify by blaming someone else. Also In the video he says if our troops were not in their lands, do we now blame T. Blair and world leaders. Lets not delve in the past its now the future. Lets say when in Britain do as Britain do.

Crusades,

Nazis,

IRA

National Front

Fundamental Muslim groups

And everyone still blames the others

EDL to certain degrees (not all of them)

Animal rights groups (not all members)

[Huskoda]

As horrible as this is, the last thing we really need from this is to cause more reciprocal hate. I see people on here who are themselves after blood and talking about all muslims being evil. It saddens me that I read on the news this morning that people have already been attacking mosques over this. This is no better an attitude than the people who attacked the soldier yesterday.

It is also disturbing that there are calls for creating an even bigger police state. Put it into perspective, 'terrorism' accounts for very, very little death and suffering here. More people are probably killed by their toilet seats every year than by terrorists. We cannot give up our privacy and freedom because every now and again some nutcase does something, just as we have not banned cars despite the huge number of deaths and maimings their use causes. This terrorism is done to provoke exactly these sorts of reactions and fuel further violence.

This was a terrible thing to happen and I hope the people involved get what they deserve, but don't take it out on innocents.

[lol-lol]

Interesting the two attackers were IC3 and not IC4 or IC6s.

Lots of issues with Christian/Moslems in West Africa as well as Southern Asia of course.

Looking at the photogragh were the both left handed too? Shall we also go after left handed people, use to do this.

All very sad.

[leckman]

Reports now saying one of the two terrorists is a Brit' of Nigerian origin.

[CFB]

Sickening!

That is all.

[kit]

Absolutley horrific :( Not really much more i can say....well not on here!!

My thoughts are with his family and friends and all serving armed forces personnel.

kit

[MartynVRS]

There's lots I could say in anger so 12 hours to think about it was a good idea.

Religions, for the most part are peaceful. In every holy book it's says something like "thou shall not kill" but I often think religions cause more problems than they solve. In this case it's nothing to do with Islam and it's a few nutters trying to get attention which they now have. I'm not religious in any way. It's all bollards. The whole thing is just horrific and for one our own soldiers to be killed in his own country is disgusting.

But there's a deeper problem and it's not all to do with "racism", but this country has lost all it's discipline and respect. When I was growing up I was taught the differences between right and wrong and if I did wrong there would be serious consequences (normally a slap off my parents, another thing that's now considered "wrong" :wonder: ). If I saw a copper I always had the thought of "what have I done?" when I was totally innocent. I'm sure most of us have had that especially when driving. Now it doesn't happen. You rarely see police let alone them doing anything because their resources have been spread so thin. It's not just the immigrants that come over here wanting us to change for them it's also the lazy and feckless to are quite happy to lie, cheat, steal and more commonly now murder their way through life.

Also having an opinion is also seemed as a bad thing lately and people look to be offended. If it's not what the do-gooders think and or is against human rights you aren't allowed to argue. There needs to be change but there's no party with the balls to sort it all out. We do need to be tougher on immigration there's no doubt but there are immigrants who are genuine and want to work here so there should be rules new people to the country have to stick to. A lot like the things you need to get into Australia or New Zealand. Degree, money, etc.

• All the laws need to be toughened up for everyone. Everyone knows that if you get sentenced for 6 years it's actually 3. Why is this? This needs to stop as do "suspended sentences". That IMO is getting away with it
  
• Longer sentences for murderers and paedos. I would say death penalty but we could get them doing something useful instead like building roads, cleaning things up, building bigger prisons would be good.
  
• Prisons needs a kick up the arse too. Most are like Butlins and should be places you don't want to go back to. I've got a few ideas for what a prison should be like but again it breaches their human rights innit...
  
• Anyone wanting to emigrate here legally needs to either have a degree or work experiences that would benefit our country. Plus there could be more criteria too
  
• If they commit crimes while here there's either big fines or they get deported back where they came from. Needs to be a deterrent to crime.
  
• Anyone here illegally they need to kick back out. I know they can't catch everyone but this needs toughening up.
  
• We need politicians with some balls. It's all well and good them coming over all diplomatic but bu66er all happens and it's all forgotten about. They are too frightened of doing anything just in case they lose votes. If they aren't prepared to do things that are right for the majority of the country then why are they there? Most are just lining their own pockets. I bet there's loads of people who would do the job for half the money and get things done.
  
• More investment in the police, NHS, emergency services. These used to be jobs that kids in school aspired to do. I bet lots still want to and it's a sector that really needs more people. It doesn't matter if this sector costs billions a year if it means the people in our country are as safe as possible.
  
• No more speed cameras/money boxes and more proper traffic cops on the streets and more opportunities for driver education.
  

[grr666]

But there's a deeper problem and it's not all to do with "racism", but this country has lost all it's discipline and respect. When I was growing up I was taught the differences between right and wrong and if I did wrong there would be serious consequences (normally a slap off my parents, another thing that's now considered "wrong" :wonder: ).

Great post Martyn. particularly this ^^^ point.

Couple this point made above with the absolutely unbelievable apathy that has

manifested and grown like a cancer in the attitudes of the average UK resident and

you have all you need to watch civilised society go flushing down the tubes.

Two or three women felt they should intervene while every 'man' there stood by

and watched.

Anyone who thinks I am wrong only needs to watch as the woman with the shopping trolley

calmly walks past the blood soaked murderer who had just beheaded (or attempted to)

someone in broad daylight. She barely altered her path to avoid him.

Like she sees several hate preaching knife attackers a day.

That's the problem, people aren't horrified by this stuff anymore.

[Coops]

Haven't watched much of the news relating to this because so much of it last night was speculation if I'm honest.

Needless to say, it's a very sad state of affairs and condolences to the family involved. The sequence of events and manner of the attack is very chilling indeed, especially with the inclusion of media these days.

There is alot being mentioned of Enoch Powell's Rivers of Blood speech from 1968 and it's links to this incident.

[Jockdooshbag]

Totally horrific and very sad.

As was the stupid intervention of the EDL. Total f---wits.

Cant actually believe no-one intervened. Not totally surprised in reality but they were happy enough to stand and watch. If they actually watched as the victim was hacked to death why did no-one at least drive their car at the attackers? No way i could stand and watch that. Even if it was too scary i would have at least walked away.

In some photos you can see mothers walking nearby with their kids. Are they mad?? Any sign of an incident if i had my child in a pram and id have been off in a shot as you dont know what it could escalate into. Some people are just so indifferent these days.

Best thing to do IMO is to give it no more media attention than is absolutely necessary. This is what they wanted plus it only incites riots. Id wager the EDL have some more retribution planned. Totally mis-directed. These EDL idiots look for any excuse to start trouble.

[MartynVRS]

Anyone who thinks I am wrong only needs to watch as the woman with the shopping trolley

calmly walks past the blood soaked murderer who had just beheaded (or attempted to)

someone in broad daylight. She barely altered her path to avoid him.

Like she sees several hate preaching knife attackers a day.

That's the problem, people aren't horrified by this stuff anymore.

This was a disturbing point for me too. Someone had been beheaded and people carried on regardless. Almost like when car alarms go off and no one bets and eyelid. It's nuts how desensitised we've got to it, almost as if it's normal. Scary stuff

[FUBAR]

RIP young man, you didn't deserve such a cowardly attack. My, as are the the thoughts of the entire civilised world are with your family, friends and colleagues.

As for the more hard line EDL types I have seen with their messages spreading like a disease on the internet. How dare they use something like this to further their own hate and treat it like a recruitment tool for the narrow minded, uneducated among us. Messages I saw from such people passed on no sympathies or specific condemnation but more a pathetic call to arms of sorts, how very dare they!

As for the understandable almost universal comments I see from all walks of life calling for the death of these so called men who carried this barbarism out. I personally do not share these views. We are built on better values and morals than to play into the hands of such vermin, who waited eagerly putting on a show until they forced the hands of the armed Police who attended. Why would anyone like to play into their hands and give them the martyrdom which they sought. We have as poor as it may seem a justice system and it MUST be allowed to work, it is our way of life and an integral part of who we are. Like it or not it is part of what the poor young man stood for in his chosen career.

I have heard a lot of comments about the now infamous 20 minutes it took for the armed Police to attend. This is a difficult one, we live in a modern society in a world where most of our foreign peers arm all their Police officers as a matter of routine. I for one have a very high level of respect for a modern Police who can command authority and respect, without needing to have a gun strapped to their hip. This however will be something that I am very sure will be reviewed and in time perhaps will change. However this will be a sad day for use as a people, should the need arise. I am from a place where tens of thousands of armed men and women were required as a matter of routine and it really is a sorry state of affairs to be in to need it, unfortunately sometimes it is needed though. A very difficult subject.

The modern society of HD video camera equipped smart phones was undoubtedly part of these terrorists plans. I cannot fathom what type of person would stand back and their first reaction is to record it and get it on youtube ASAP........ How shallow can someone be? Equally to those who hunt down such footage on the likes of youtube and liveleak. I cannot believe some peoples lack of humility, carrying on the work of the scum who carried this out, doing EXACTLY what they want you to.

On a different note within the FB community in the wake of speculation of the possibility of a ban on wearing uniform in public. Service personnel have on mass been changing their profile pictures to one of themselves in uniform. This started very shortly after the news went out and as a mark of respect to a fallen colleague. That has my respect!

[MartynVRS]

The Help4Heroes has seen a massive demand on their website the last 24 hours too which is nice to see. A lot of people on FB jumped on the bandwagon a bit and started saying it was the Muslims fault,etc. The EDL are just as cowardly as the one who did it hiding behind balaclavas. The irony being when it's them screaming to ban the burka

[Jockdooshbag]

The sad thing is that our govt wont be able to do anything about the situation. We cant even get that nutter cleric Katada out of the country. Its laughable. Our govt is so impotent.

Im not blaming them for the actual incident yesterday but just highlighting how soft they are in general which in turn leaves us vulnerable to attacks like these.

[Scribbler]

Anyone who has previously posted that this has nothing to do with religion or islam should hang their head in shame. Its exactly this liberal tree hugging attitude thats got this country in this mess. Its Exactly the Hate preaching, 'Western values' hating Islamic idiology preached by imams that has casued these nutters to go out and do what it says in the Koran Litterally. I think if you check out Muslim teachings you will find that we are all legitimate targets in the eyes of their faith. The few two faced muslim comunity leaders / representitives who have come out publicly to condem this and try to distance themselves from this despicable act are the same that attend the mosques where the hatefull rethoric is preached and turn a blind eye. Some Muslim leaders no doubt wont even bother condeming it and will try to claim its in retaliation for the actions of our brave servicemen and women. Some want to come across as all nice and respectfull of other faiths but the time will come when the imigrants outnumber the natives and it will be to late to stop sharia law being implemented on the inhabitants of this island. Religion in my opinion is the root of all evil but islam takes the bisuit. Can you imagine stepping into a Cristian, Catholic Church or Budhist temple and hear them preatching the death of other faiths. Please don't come back with the Crusades as a justifiable excuse There was no such thing as science in them days and in this modern age there is no place for religion.

[MartynVRS]

Maybe we should just ban religion. Job jobbed

[Coops]

This picture is on FB claiming to be the poor victim of yesterdays attack, as of yet with no name.

Perhaps it would be more respectful to wait for the authorities to confirm his identify, I would hate it if it was wrong.

[@Lee]

Perhaps it would be more respectful to wait for the authorities to confirm his identify, I would hate it if it was wrong.

beat me to it! It's just been on the news that the MOD have not yet released his details.

[Jockdooshbag]

As someone else posted...they didnt look very "islamic". Baggy jeans with the gusset down by their knees. Looked like a couple of wanabe gangstas although i didnt think gangstas drove tigras.

I doubt we will ever really know their real motives or affiliations. The media will play the islamic terrorist card as it makes for good headlines and the govt likes its public to be scared of these things as it justifies their next incursion into someone elses country.