6 minutes ago, Offski said:

I have family working now in New Mexico on the turbines.  Funny how well they do there.

Pattern to build and connect 1GW New Mexico wind farm _ Windpower Monthly.mhtml

 

Still will have the same long term problems......20yrs & thats it..maybe repower/rebuild the bases....but they have way more barren land than we do....so easier to just build a new farm somewhere else....we don't have that option as most of our land is taken for housing etc or farming.....what little we have free is countryside ...but then to generate all the electricity to replace all cars/trucks etc with EV the countryside will disappear under a forest of turbines..if certain people have their way...

Oh & here's a good paper on the analysis of degradation of output from a windfarm over its lifespan...

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960148113005727

 

 

 

 

People need houses, transport and energy, drinking water as well,

and the nuclear sites are never going to be cleaned up and generations will always pay for expensive energy just to store nuclear waste.

Paying the cost of the coal generation as well, and cleaning that mess up.

 

Scotland hosts groundbreaking wind energy project to build new homes _ Society _ The Guardian.mhtml

Shocking news!.........EVs, having been around for 5 minutes, face issues requiring solutions.

 

Meanwhile - coming to Goodwood:

https://electrek.co/2018/07/09/vw-break-another-record-all-electric-pikes-peak-race-car/

Edited 9 July, 20187 yr by Ryeman

Leaf loses

LG wins

https://electrek.co/2018/07/09/nissan-battery-cell-fails-leaf-lg-batteries/

If China are on board who is to disagree -

https://electrek.co/2018/07/09/bmw-all-electric-ix3-suv-china-exported-battery-contract/

 

Maybe it’s a “look over there” distraction ........or are you serious?.

https://electrek.co/2018/07/09/uk-extensive-new-plan-all-electric-2040/

8 hours ago, Ryeman said:

Shocking news!.........EVs, having been around for 5 minutes, face issues requiring solutions.

 

 

 

Just getting the other side of the coin out there as way too much news etc tout EV, windfarms etc as our saviours & give the impression that they have no problems whatsoever....

 

 

I was thinking just how many dead birds i have seen or not as it is at the base of turbines when i am up among them.

Certainly nothing like the amount of dead birds at the end of a shoot on Scottish moorland and hills.

But then they are breed to be shot and that is what keeps the Estates / Businesses running and money & employment in the communities.

The hills & glens do not look as they do because they were left alone.

 

I will look around the wind farm today...

 

Edited 10 July, 20187 yr by Offski

16 hours ago, Offski said:

No Taxi Licence and not living in the Highlands of Scotland probably something to do with it.

And the lack of charging points (and low current capacity electricity connections), all the mountains/hills and the distances involved they would probably have had to call a recovery truck at some point when they ran out of charge ... which would possibly have meant a long walk to find a phone as mobile coverage in the mountains is ****.

 

This is the rural living reality which EVs need to be able to solve before they become a real option for anyone living well away from a city.

lol, that is such a lovely sounding Scotland that some would like to have people think still exists, sadly those piles of stones and ruined crofts are now lovely Eco houses and holiday homes, actually the long dead end glens have habitation these days, and electricity, they are work places,

and in lots of cases have renewable / green electricity with hydro schemes & wind turbines with foundations built on solid bases using waste materials from around the various quarries that have been part of land development, improvement and road building since the days of drove roads and moving cattle across Scotland from Hills to the sea.

Check out how many Farms or Estates are registered as Energy Companies.

You are never more than 75 miles from the sea in Scotland.

http://greenerscotland.org/greener-travel/greener-driving/charge-point-map 

I can ride an electric bike with 40 mile range and now get it charged without the need to carry a 2nd battery,

but i am taking one on my tour of Scotland anyway.

No glen i can not ride up and out again with range anxiety these days, and when you ride a bike you know where there are hills, and mountain passes, 

and really in Scotland they are not far from civilisation or a camp site a CC on a farm.

 

EV's are useless when you need to do hundreds of miles a day or non stop, so that is when you do not use one, simple as that, 

and that is why i have not got one, but have tried them.

If i needed a little city car i would have one and use the Government Interest free loan to get it.

 

No dead wildlife today at the turbines, just free range hens with their cheap electricity supply.  No battery chickens here.

Edited 15 July, 20187 yr by Offski

Head for thinking, use land to make money. 

Forestry land is usually not in the towns and cities and electricity is being produced and just needs stored and used or put into the national grid.

Wind and hydro developments.mhtml

 

Communities without Filling Stations is not something unusual in Scotland.

Mobile Phone Reception and Internet and even TV / Radio Reception can be pathetic,  but if the Scottish Government are going to have success in pollution reduction and EV users in rural areas they need to pull a finger out.

 

At least electricity is easily generated and facilities built, even in the most out of the way places.

This is one of the busiest areas for tourists in vehicles now.

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-10729584 

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-34899406 

 

forest-renewables-current-schemes-apr-18.pdf

 

How difficult is it when you have the space or make space?

 

Edited 10 July, 20187 yr by Offski

6 hours ago, Offski said:

lol, that is such a lovely sounding Scotland that some would like to have people think still exists, sadly those piles of stones and ruined crofts are now lovely Eco houses and holiday homes, actually the long dead end glens have habitation these days, and electricity, they are work places,

and in lots of cases have renewable / green electricity with hydro schemes & wind turbines with foundations built on solid bases using waste materials from around the various quarries that have been part of land development, improvement and road building since the days of drove roads and moving cattle across Scotland from Hills to the sea.

Check out how many Farms or Estates are registered as Energy Companies.

You are never more than 75 miles from the sea in Scotland.

http://greenerscotland.org/greener-travel/greener-driving/charge-point-map 

I can ride an electric bike with 40 mile range and now get it charged without the need to carry a 2nd battery,

but i am taking one on my tour of Scotland anyway.

No glen i can not ride up and out again with range anxiety these days, and when you ride a bike you know where there are hills, and mountain passes, 

and really in Scotland they are not far from civilisation or a camp site a CC on a farm.

 

EV's are useless when you need to do hundreds of miles a day or non stop, so that is when you do not use one, simple as that, 

and that is why i have not got one, but have tried them.

If i needed a little city car i would have one and use the Government Interest free loan to get it.

 

No dead wildlife today at the turbines, just free range hens with their cheap electricity supply.  No battery chickens here.

 

 

Wonder could chickens be used as batteries though? Free range electricity storage? 

You can run engines on chicken sh-it.   (edit) mixed with bull sh-it!

 

I best call that 'Bio-gas from chicken manure' when applying for a development grant.

 

Edited 11 July, 20187 yr by Offski

Battery research goes on - for chemical engineering nerds:

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1117633_iron-triflouride-could-make-better-electric-car-batteries

Hyundai’s ‘solid state’ plans -

https://electrek.co/2018/07/11/hyundai-invests-solid-state-battery-startup-claiming-breakthrough/

 

to be taken with a grain of salt apparently 

On 10/07/2018 at 11:29, Offski said:

EV's are useless when you sometimes need to do hundreds of miles a day or non stop and can only afford one car

Edits inline.

^^^ Everytime i would need to do hundreds of miles, not sometimes when i would want to do hundreds of miles.

 

Do you mean that people might only sometimes want to do hundreds of miles so does not matter when then do not want to?

 

PS

& maybe people can afford more than one car but only want one car as that is all they have parking / storage for.

Or maybe they have no car and hire them.  They might hire a EV for Local Use & a ICE engine one for longer trips.

Now EV Clubs are available for use like that.

http://eva.scot 

Edited 12 July, 20187 yr by Offski

There's this debate on EV forum.

 

Is sometimes needing hundreds of miles enough to justify having a car able to do that distance without stopping?

 

Manufacturers are pushing for more and more range as selling point for people driving ICE cars. But most of the time you don't need that range. You'd then stuck carrying around a dead weight for the sake of sometimes needing the range.

 

Public charging infrastructure is the key. With good enough rapid charging reliability, I honestly don't see any issue with a 40-50kWh cars. Drive 2 hours 140 miles and rest 30min at each stop. The battery is big enough to allow long enough drive between stops, it is also small enough to be economically and environmentally viable.

9 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

Public charging infrastructure is the key. With good enough rapid charging reliability, I honestly don't see any issue with a 40-50kWh cars. Drive 2 hours 140 miles and rest 30min at each stop. The battery is big enough to allow long enough drive between stops, it is also small enough to be economically and environmentally viable.

The cost of installing charging points every 100 miles or so on every possible route throughout the country, including the less populated areas well away from major cities, is unlikely to be met by commercial organisations (as there's no profit in it for them unless charging becomes something you have to explicitly pay for - so Government would have to foot the bill.

 

Then there's the issue of grid capacity, on peak driving days the generating capacity will be stretched (possibly overstretched according to some, especially when wind and solar output is reduced by climatic conditions) to accommodate millions of fast charging EVs - so some charging points would have to reduce their charging rate and hence take longer to charge, making a 30 minutes charge become a 4 hour charge.

 

Oh, and the recently reported problem where a Nissan Leaf could only fast charge once per journey needs solving too.

 

These are all solvable problems, but that solution will take time and money - and maybe, just maybe, longer range EVs will be a better interim solution until the charging infrastructure and grid capacity are fully in place?

Edited 12 July, 20187 yr by SWBoy

If KFC put in charging infrastructure I would imagine McDonalds would want to compete for the traveler $£€

28 minutes ago, Ryeman said:

If KFC put in charging infrastructure I would imagine McDonalds would want to compete for the traveler $£€

Nearest KFC to me that isn't in the middle of a shopping mall without vehicle access (excluding dangling a cable down 3 flights of stairs and halfway across the mall)? - 60 miles.

 

Where roadside food outlets exist they would be a good option - but they are widely spaced in many more rural areas.

 

The charging infrastructure needs to be 100% national, not just major cities and major routes, for the suggestion by wyx097 of 40-50kWh EVs to be a viable long term solution. Hence my suggestion that the short-term solution could be higher battery capacity EVs.

Edited 12 July, 20187 yr by SWBoy

If the available affordable EV's with a full charge can not go from Stirling to Inverness so 143 miles on the A9 through the average speed cameras in Summer without needing to stop to charge them then come winter time they are just hopeless.

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-41551535 

As to the AA Routes 2 hours 43 minutes for the journey non stop, that can be a wish and a dream.

 

 

Edited 12 July, 20187 yr by Offski

If a problem is identified I have no doubt local authorities won’t want to miss out on tourism revenue frinstance.

48 minutes ago, SWBoy said:

The cost of installing charging points every 100 miles or so on every possible route throughout the country, including the less populated areas well away from major cities, is unlikely to be met by commercial organisations (as there's no profit in it for them unless charging becomes something you have to explicitly pay for - so Government would have to foot the bill.

 

Then there's the issue of grid capacity, on peak driving days the generating capacity will be stretched (possibly overstretched according to some, especially when wind and solar output is reduced by climatic conditions) to accommodate millions of fast charging EVs - so some charging points would have to reduce their charging rate and hence take longer to charge, making a 30 minutes charge become a 4 hour charge.

 

Oh, and the recently reported problem where a Nissan Leaf could only fast charge once per journey needs solving too.

 

These are all solvable problems, but that solution will take time and money - and maybe, just maybe, longer range EVs will be a better interim solution until the charging infrastructure and grid capacity are fully in place?

All good valid points.

 

The charging speed shouldn't be too much issue if battery is installed with the chargers. Distributed virtual power plant is the future. Plus, when you are driving, your house isn't using as much electricity and its battery and solar can be of use.  Of course smart grid is waaaaay in the future.

 

The 40kWh Nissan Leaf issue is Nissan dropping the ball. Unfortunately it is only recently reported, but I've known this from day 1 when Nissan didn't put in any thermal management on their new battery. Almost twice the power density packed into the same area as 24kWh without cooling solution? Who thought it's a good idea?

 

Long range battery is desirable, but it rises the cost of entry for EV ownership, thus doesn't help its image. At those times, I think series-hybrid may be the solution, like i3 REx.

 

4 minutes ago, Offski said:

If the available affordable EV's with a full charge can not go from Stirling to Inverness so 143 miles on the A9 through the average speed cameras in Summer without needing to stop to charge them then come winter time they are just hopeless.

As to the AA Routes 2 hours 43 minutes for the journey non stop, that can be a wish and a dream.

 

40kWh EV is able to do that route. Remember in an EV, if you are moving slowly in traffic, you are actually saving fuel!

 

I've no problem slowly moving forward in traffic in my Leaf, but it's very painful (and not smooth) in the Octavia.

22 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

Long range battery is desirable, but it rises the cost of entry for EV ownership, thus doesn't help its image. At those times, I think series-hybrid may be the solution, like i3 REx.

I think hybrids especially PHEVs as an alternative to long range batteries is possibly the best solution of all in the short-term since it bootstraps the existing fossil fuel infrastructure (avoiding range anxiety) while reducing inner city pollution levels compared to ICEs.

 

Yes it's not the final solution of long range EVs with light batteries (which will take a step change in battery technology, an area that has had the slowest rate of change until recently) but it would be a good step on the way - and difficult problems rarely get solved in one big step.