4 wheel alignment results - Superb Estate

[TasMan]

Seeking some advice on toe and camber settings following a 4 wheel alignment done this morning....

After getting a full set of new tyres I booked in for a 4 wheel alignment locally.

The rear passenger side tyre was badly worn on the inside so things were clearly out of adjustment, seems to be a common Superb Estate issue....

The garage was using a Hunter system and gave before and after prints as attached.  Anyway, I am not convinced on the new settings and questioned these at the time, but was told 'its a 4 wheel alignment and we only ever adjust the toe, and not the camber as its not adjustable...?!'  I got a second opinion elsewhere (Kwik Fit of all places....) and was advised everything should be 'green' suggesting camber is adustable.  I questioned the original garage again but was pretty much told they only advertise 'alignment' and not camber....  Am I wrong to expect the camber to be part of the deal on a 4 wheel alignment ?  

Left Front and Rear camber appear out of tolerance, and worse than before alignment...should I be getting this re-done ....?  

Thanks

 

Before

After

Edited 23 June, 2018 by TasMan

[bigjohn]

I'm not sure you can adjust the camber and it varies depending on the loading of the car. With the independent rear suspension the camber changes as you lean into a corner (that's one of the reasons a Superb II handles better than a MKI) but a side effect of this if you have heavy passengers in the back and luggage in the boot then the camber also changes - this can wear the inside of both rear tyres. This happened to me when driving throug France with lots of big people and luggage on board - I think this is potentially worse on the estate due to the extra weight of the car and the capacity to carry more stuff!

 

 

 

[TasMan]

Thanks, am still doing my homework on this one, lots of folk saying the Octavia back end has camber adjustment so I would assume the Superb has too.  I drive around most of the time with little in the boot, as it was at the aligner today, so in theory a proper set up on that basis would suit my driving 80 - 90% of the time.  On family trips away, and times of towing etc the tyres are all pumped up.  I have been reading folks on here saying Skoda tyre pressures err on the comfort side and recommend going higher for normal use.  Someone saying they run around with maximum inflation on the back which has cured inner tyre wear...!  I guess every situation is different but meantime will be getting in touch with another garage in the area via the website 'Alignmycar' and see what they say.  Keep you posted.  Still interested in any other feedback, and where I might find the correct factory settings...?  Cheers

[bigjohn]

OK - just checked in the Golf 2009-2012  (58 to 62 reg) Petrol & Diesel Haynes manual which is the closest manual I could find to cover my Superb II inlcuding it has my EA111 tsi engine   (Lots of things are the same)  - To adjust the camber there are some "Rear toe eccentric bushes " to slacken and rotate  (and tighten)

 

 

 

Edited 23 June, 2018 by bigjohn
Updated full Haynes manual desription

[TasMan]

Cheers bigjohn, thats similar to what I have read, regarding eccentric bushes, its highly likely the garage wasn't aware of them.  Hoping to have something else sorted out this week and will update in due course.

[bigjohn]

My rear tyre wear was on the inside of both rear wheels - the car didn't like being fully laden. Saying that the two lads in the back were 6ft 5" and 6ft 7" and the amount of luggage was something else.  I also read about inflating the tyres a bit more as well which I do now.

 

Tyres still did OK though - original Continentals lasted 35k miles.

 

[gav_is_con]

The eccentric bushes on my 110k superb Combi are pretty much on the last legs. Just about adjusted them about 2 months back. Just like the Octy the bush just perishes and needs replacement. Be aware you could come across issues depending on what yours are like age/miles/life.. I plan to replace them before the next alignment. Sounds like the 2 places are not aware of how to align a car properly.  

[TasMan]

9 hours ago, bigjohn said:

Tyres still did OK though - original Continentals lasted 35k miles.

Got approx 20k out of the set of Bridgestone Potenzas two years ago, the fronts would have ran further but they were showing signs of cracks on the outer edge with 4 - 5mm left so opted for new tyres all round, gone for Crossclimate + this time, will see how they do.  Initial reaction is less noise which is welcome!

8 hours ago, gav_is_con said:

The eccentric bushes on my 110k superb Combi are pretty much on the last legs. Just about adjusted them about 2 months back. Just like the Octy the bush just perishes and needs replacement. Be aware you could come across issues depending on what yours are like age/miles/life.. I plan to replace them before the next alignment. Sounds like the 2 places are not aware of how to align a car properly.  

Thanks Gav, only been to the one place for alignment (tyre fitter didn't have 4 wheel gear) and yes I don't think they properly knew what they were doing as when I challenged the camber settings with two members of staff they were pretty unsure of themselves with regards the basics of toe and camber...not impressed.  Noted your experience with the bushes, my car is a 2014 with 36k miles so should have a few years left in them yet.  Awaiting contact from two more places locally for prices and availability.   Have you found inner tyre wear a problem ?  Cheers

[gav_is_con]

I have owned the car for just over a year now and it came with brand new front 18" Avons and one new rear the same, these i requested after initial inspection with owner as 2-3mm was too low for my liking. The remaining rear tyre was nearly new so remained. It was on 87k approx and was aligned not long after purchase. Plus due to EGR replacement aligned again a few months later. Winter I ran my 16" winters and post winter and a wrecked pothole tyre 18"s back on and another alignment just under a year later. The aligner commented on my rear central tyre wear being high creating a low spot. I was running at 36psi following comments on here. But for comfort and that reason reduced to 34psi. Given it's a motorway car unladen, tyre wear on the whole is slow coming up to 110k now. I am yet to experience the wear commented on by a number of Combi owners, maybe it's more noticeable as you get down to 4/3mm if insides are scrubbed.

I have definitely seen it on the Octy hatch, it's not pretty and a waste of an otherwise good overall tread tyre. 

[williamshatnerspants]

I'm not sure if you have read the post a while back about 'inner' tyre wear, but a friendly Australian member had some good points on wheel alignment, and also noted that many alignment places don't (or won't know how to) adjust the subframe to make changes. Finding the best wheel alignment specialist is critical when setting up the Superb.

[FlyingSpanner]

g

Edited 9 January, 2019 by FlyingSpanner

[TasMan]

On ‎26‎/‎06‎/‎2018 at 01:12, williamshatnerspants said:

I'm not sure if you have read the post a while back about 'inner' tyre wear, but a friendly Australian member had some good points on wheel alignment, and also noted that many alignment places don't (or won't know how to) adjust the subframe to make changes. Finding the best wheel alignment specialist is critical when setting up the Superb.

Thanks, yeah think I saw that post during my searches on here, some very good information, chap is brad1.8T ?  

 

9 hours ago, VWGDT said:

I know a company called Camspec in Crawley, they have the latest Beissbarth four wheel kit with tools to set up front camera, the other issue is knowing it is calibrated correctly and the operators know how to use it. Also many people are unaware of the S curve setting, that made a massive difference to the stability of my Audi S4.

Thanks, my local Skoda dealer has Beissbarth I believe.  This has been a steep learning curve for me, will look into the S curve setting.

 

I am booked in for 9th July for a further alignment on Hunter Hawkeye 3D equipment, will see how that goes.  This new garage has a good rep. of setting up cars for different applications (race, road etc) so I am hoping the operator knows his stuff.  Will soon find out.......Still trying to track down the factory settings to compare....

 

[chimaera]

The S-curve setting applies to the mk1 Superb, since it used the same multi-link front setup as the other B5/C5/C6 cars. Superb mk2 has a McPherson strut front end which is simpler but offers less scope for adjustment.

[edbostan]

Interesting. I have been driving for 50 years and never had a car 4-wheel aligned - only tracking. I can't say that I have had any unusual tyre wear on the various cars I have owned.

[TasMan]

2 hours ago, edbostan said:

Interesting. I have been driving for 50 years and never had a car 4-wheel aligned - only tracking. I can't say that I have had any unusual tyre wear on the various cars I have owned.

Likewise I am the same, only ever had tracking done.  The tyres were changed just as I got the car so this is the first interim change and I can safely say the rears were shot.  I hadn't noticed the extreme inner edge wear despite checking the tread weekly for the past 4 - 6 weeks.  Clearly an alignment is needed and I can reflect this back to a very large pot hole I hit maybe 4 - 6 months ago on the passenger side.  It was this side that the back tyre was worn through to the cords.  I am normally very particular about tyres and wear so this was quite a surprise.  Reading on here, tyre pressure seems to matter A LOT on the Superb Estate so I will be playing with that going forward.

 

[chimaera]

4 hours ago, edbostan said:

Interesting. I have been driving for 50 years and never had a car 4-wheel aligned - only tracking. I can't say that I have had any unusual tyre wear on the various cars I have owned.

Cars have much more complex suspension systems that they did in the past, with greater range of adjustment and therefore more ways to go out of alignment. I think there's also an element of ignorance (not necessarily deliberate) among parts of the independent car repair network when it comes to modern technology on vehicles and what's needed to keep it at its best. I'd be willing to bet a lot of your cars in the last 20 years could probably have benefited from 4-wheel alignment if someone knew about it.

[TasMan]

Just an update to this thread.  Its amazing the difference when you find a place that knows what they are doing....!

Took my car to another garage today who have a Hunter Hawkeye 3D Proalign set up.

The technician spent over 2 hours on the car to get the set up spot on.  A little better than the 45 minutes of the previous place...

Today's 'before' readings were quite a bit different to the 'after' readings from the first place. Whether that is calibration of the equipment, or due to the different type of Hunter system I am unsure but its certainly interesting and I have more confidence in today's readings than the first lot. 

I received two 'after' printouts....first attempt things were immediately better and no 'red' evident which was a good start and no getting fobbed off about the camber settings like the last place.  A brief road test resulted in the car going back on the ramps for further tweaks.  The technician wasn't happy with the steering wheel position not being bang on straight and wanted to pull the rear camber in further.  Further tweaks and another road test things were even better.  I was surprised when I was told they still weren't happy with the steering wheel position.  To me it is spot on but the guy was serious to the extent any issues whatsoever I was to get it back to them for further adjustment...from driving 20 odd miles today this isn't going to be necessary.  They also do free alignment checks which is good to know so this will become part of my annual maintenance, whether it needs adjusted or not, hoping rear tyre wear will improve.

Anyway, I will let the printouts do the talking and pass on a big recommendation to the guys at Planet Performance of Dundonald, Ayrshire.

http://www.planetperformance.co.uk/

 

Before

Initial Adjustment

Final Adjustment

Edited 10 July, 2018 by TasMan
Correction

[Shaunieboy]

Old thread resurrection expert, checking in 🙄

 

So I went to Kwik Fit, just out of interest, to see if they could do 4 wheel hunter alignment on my mk2 superb estate. The guy swore that the rear camber was not adjustable, only toe in/out. Same on the fronts. £85...

 

I walked away. 

 

I'm scratching my head here because some of you are definitely getting camber adjusted!

 

 

[chimaera]

Front camber isn't adjustable on individual wheels but it can be centered by shifting the subframe left or right. There's a special tool available to do it.

[Shaunieboy]

I wonder if a dealers would be a better bet, if the price was right. I'm pretty disappointed with the rear wheel camber settings from factory. Pages and pages of people complaining about tyres getting wrecked on other forums. 

[DEL80Y]

@Shaunieboy
Go to Alignmycar and enter your postcode and get someone that knows what they are doing

The dealerships will not have Hunter 4 wheel alignment

And as for Kwik Fit all the gear and NO idea

Def rear camber adjustment

Edited 8 January, 2020 by DEL80Y

[Shaunieboy]

I've found a specialist place locally. Let's see what they say

[langers2k]

It should be the same adjustment points as a MKV/MKVI Golf or the MK2 Octavia.

 

[TasMan]

19 hours ago, Shaunieboy said:

 

So I went to Kwik Fit, 

 

First mistake !! 😁      I too went to a 'tyre specialist' who had Hunter gear....but sadly.......no idea, and I argued with them about what adjustments were available.  They spent about 15 minutes faffing around and I left less than impressed. 

 

19 hours ago, Shaunieboy said:

I wonder if a dealers would be a better bet, if the price was right. I'm pretty disappointed with the rear wheel camber settings from factory. Pages and pages of people complaining about tyres getting wrecked on other forums. 

 

Dealer may help but I don't think a lot of them have the proper equipment.  As Delboy says, check out Alignmycar and you will find someone within striking distance.  Check out any reviews on Yell/Google/Facebook etc, look around and if you are travelling a few miles book in advance and make sure you can wait while its done.  You should get before and after printouts of the alignment results.   As I hinted in another post, running the tyres at slightly higher pressure is working well for me and I have the Superb Estate. 

 

Let us know how you get on.  Cheers

Edited 9 January, 2020 by TasMan

[Shaunieboy]

Booked in at AK Automotive this thursday so I'll post the results. These guys look fantastic- have a look on their page, they have some great reviews specifically for their geometry work.

 

Amazingly they are less than a mile away from me 😎