What annoyed you today?

[Gaz]

21 minutes ago, Breezy_Pete said:

Stay strong Lee. 

 

+1 👍

 

I gave up in January 1986, going from 20-30 a day to none.  If a weak willed soft southern jessie like me can do it....

 

It gets easier 

 

Gaz

 

[petrolcan]

Walking out to my car and finding someone has decided to key the paintwork on every panel, front to back, down to the basecoat.

 

This is why we can't have nice things 😕 

[mac11irl]

thats terrible @petrolcan

little sods should be madebeo a massive amount of community work for that sort of thing.

[Warrior193]

39 minutes ago, mac11irl said:

thats terrible @petrolcan

little sods should be madebeo a massive amount of community work for that sort of thing.

Plus a little surgery to stop them from breeding.

[Gaz]

3 hours ago, mac11irl said:

little sods should be....

 

'I've done some bad things in my life, little sod.  Things I'm not proud of.  I promised someone I love very much that I would never go back to being that person.  But for you, little sod, I'm going to make an exception.'

 

Might not be word perfect, but you get the sentiment 🤬

 

G

[Breezy_Pete]

Emergency lighting testing.

 

Lights all go out in the area I work, with no warning whatsoever.

Couple of minutes later some grunt from the testing company wanders in and says "Sorry mate, the lights are gonna be off for a bit. Three hours. Gotta test the batteries"

 

🤬

 

It'll be me that then has to replace the batteries in any that don't last for this ridiculous length of time, rather than accept their vast quote for replacing the whole light units. 

 

🤬

 

Health and Safety BS makes me very angry sometimes.

 

 

[Warrior193]

2 minutes ago, Breezy_Pete said:

Emergency lighting testing.

 

Lights all go out in the area I work, with no warning whatsoever.

Couple of minutes later some grunt from the testing company wanders in and says "Sorry mate, the lights are gonna be off for a bit. Three hours. Gotta test the batteries"

 

🤬

 

It'll be me that then has to replace the batteries in any that don't last for this ridiculous length of time, rather than accept their vast quote for replacing the whole light units. 

 

🤬

 

Health and Safety BS makes me very angry sometimes.

 

 

A point - for the full duration, annual EML test, the building is not supposed to be occupied in the period following the test until the batteries have recharged.  

[Breezy_Pete]

I doubt we'll be expected to comply with that. In fact I doubt they'll even mention it.

[Breezy_Pete]

@Warrior193 you seem to know about this subject; what's the rationale for the emergency lights needing to work for three hours from power outage time, please?

[Breezy_Pete]

Aaaand the lights just flicked back on, well under 3 hours. What a farce. 🤬

[Warrior193]

2 hours ago, Breezy_Pete said:

@Warrior193 you seem to know about this subject; what's the rationale for the emergency lights needing to work for three hours from power outage time, please?

It depends on the evacuation plan for the building - generally, EMLs are rated at one or three hours duration - with the three hour rating being practically the default nowadays.

To comply with fire regulations, the requirement is to test the EML installation monthly ('flick test' for function only) and a full-duration test annually.

The three hour duration setup allows a building to be occupied after a partial discharge, say during a short-term power outage, but the building is not supposed to be occupied after a full duration test until the batteries have fully recharged (normally 24 hours)

[Warrior193]

1 hour ago, Breezy_Pete said:

Aaaand the lights just flicked back on, well under 3 hours. What a farce. 🤬

Hmmm. that sounds like typical sub-contractor test - I would love to see the test compliance record sheet.

[Breezy_Pete]

I think I might go home just in case...

[MikeTheThinker]

3 hours ago, Breezy_Pete said:

Lights all go out in the area I work, with no warning whatsoever.

What? They didn't tell you 7 clear days in advance it was to be "Bring a Candle to Work Day"?

[mac11irl]

5 hours ago, Warrior193 said:

Hmmm. that sounds like typical sub-contractor test - I would love to see the test compliance record sheet.

 

i think @Breezy_Pete should ask for a copy to ensure the building is compliant before returning to work 😉

[Breezy_Pete]

I expect I'll be given it so I know which lights need fixing this time.

I might refuse on the basis of DILLIGAF. 

Need to move on anyway.

Edited 11 October, 2023 by Breezy_Pete
Missed an L

[Warrior193]

24 minutes ago, Breezy_Pete said:

I expect I'll be given it so I know which lights need fixing this time.

I might refuse on the basis of DILLIGAF. 

Need to move on anyway.

How big is your EML installation? Depending on how many fail, I'm guessing that might take up a fair amount of your time.

I used to do the annual and the monthly testing at my Health Centre - as well as most of the repairs - I stopped doing the annuals and most of the repairs when mis-management facilities contractor changed, and they refused to accept that annual testing had to be done out of hours. Rather odd, as the electrical contractor now responsible for the annual tests does it - out of hours! 

[Breezy_Pete]

I'll message you about it tomorrow after a walk round.

If I get out of bed to go there...

[J.R.]

Unless things have changed when I was installing fire alarms and emergency lighting each circuit should have a key operated switch (just a pronged lever not a lock key) to isolate the power from the emergency light(s) only, these are the things that should be regularly tested, using the key will remove the power from the emergency light(s) but not the main lighting on that circuit so the test should be able to be carried out without disturbing anybody.

 

Switching off all the lights especially for 3 hours sounds like laziness or incompetence.

[Graham Butcher]

The attached booklet might be of some assistance on the emergency lighting requirements and testing.

Emergency_Lighting_Pocket_Guide_June_2021.pdf

[Breezy_Pete]

Sounds like things have changed @J.R.

 

 

 

Edited 11 October, 2023 by Breezy_Pete

[J.R.]

I looked at the document and jumped to page 32 and there was a photo of a very ugly but functional test switch, the ones I used looked like a plain blanking plate with a couple of small holes in.

 

I did not get involved in the regular periodic testing, I would just use the test switch to confirm that the luminaire lit up, I have one in my Hôtel.

 

When I said they could be tested without disturbing staff in the building it was true but I hadn't thought it through, if you power one or more down for 2 hours you can maintain the normal lighting during that time (the now disturbance) but the batteries would then be discharged so could not give their rated protection were there to be a power failure straight afterwards, so I can see the need for testing being done out of hours.

 

From that page:

 

Emergency lighting test switches
The use of a miniature circuit breaker (MCB)* or fuse which isolates the whole lighting
circuit is not acceptable as this could introduce a risk of injury when the emergency
lights are being tested.

 

Which says to me that the circuit must have a test switch to isolate only the emergency lighting luminaires, thats how it was and it looks like it hasn't changed.

 

I was at the Mairie of my old village when someone working in the municipal workshop tripped the main RCD leaving everyone in darkness, I have carried a Maglite AA in my pocket for 20 years since travelling so I made my way to the fusebox and git everything back up and running, I noticed that the emergency lights had only come on for a few seconds and that for only a couple of them, so iI solated the lighting circuit to confirm my suspicion, all of the batteries were flat, the engineers had been coming in twice a year testing taking money for nothing for decades, the staff didn't even know they had emergency lighting.

 

Knowing France as I do I doubt anything has changed and they are still paying for checks not to be done and the test certificate signed.

[Graham Butcher]

Those emergency lighting test key switches come in a variety of formats, the one on page 32 is for use on an industrial installation where the circuits are wired in conduit. The switches can come as  a white plate switch, or one designed to fit into a multigang grid switch plate, which can be of the industrial type, white plastic or metal decorative finishes such as brass, bronze, chrome etc.  

[J.R.]

I like the 2nd to last one that is foolproof regarding testing as it will re-eastablish the current at the end of the test period, with the manual type there is the possibility that the operator will forget to turn back on one of them.

 

Or maybe my memory is playing tricks with me, maybe on the type I used you have to hold the key in place to cut the current and the spring loading makes it impossible to leave it off unless you stand there holding it in. In which case all that I said before is tosh!

 

I still have the test key in the top of my toolbox together with break glass test keys, panic button ones and others.

Edited 12 October, 2023 by J.R.

[Paws4Thot]

Autodialers - There's no way to block them beyond blocking every individual number they dial from...