Wow - used my Winter tires in anger today

[GrantS508]

Don't bother driving from Lossiemouth if it's minging on the road anyways, I don't wanna go home that much!

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[Moley RUFC]

Well I had my 225/40/18 Goodyear Ultra Grip Performance 2 tyres on for a couple of days now.

Needless to say they have been fantastic and given me some humorous moments especially coming up Rose Hill (extremely steep hill on Lickey Hills, Worcestershire) where I was able to drive past many stuck cars and even had to stop on the hill and restart with no momentum due to BMW sliding back down the hill.

Superb tyre, although not been out much today!

[Metblackrat]

I know this is a public forum, and you're of duty, and at the end of the day entitled to your opinion as anyone else, but given your posting as a pursuit driver for the plod then I'm surprised you're not encouraging folk to be more sensible! I totally agree driver training, but hey anything to help the non car types who struggle in the dry let alone snow would be appreciated by the rest of us!

My point is that the correct training gives you the skill to control any car safely, irrespective of what tyres are fitted. Spend your cash on yourself rather than your car!

[stever750]

My point is that the correct training gives you the skill to control any car safely, irrespective of what tyres are fitted. Spend your cash on yourself rather than your car!

Totally agree with your philosophy, but my point is that a well trained driver would know not to even attempt to drive where there is no grip. You can't drive up steep hills in snow on summer tyres no matter how much skill you've got!

[Gizmo]

I have tried them, didn't notice a difference.

None of the emergency services fit them as standard over the winter and manage (I spent most of today in a 530 estate with summer tyres on it and didn't crash once despite doing 100mph+).

Money would be better spent on driver training IMO.

So you are either a driving god or the conditions were not cold enough if you didn’t notice ANY difference, because as anyone will tell you who has driven on a decent winter tyre they are night and day simple. Are all the videos done on ice rinks etc wrong?

Sure everyone can benefit from better training yourself included, but even people doing your job have ‘incidents’ - usually when a muppet doesn’t notice you or does something stupid, you take evasive action but without the correct kit the odds are stacked against you as you are potentially already driving much faster than everyone but the person your are in pursuit of.

I can drive in the snow and ice on summer tyres, but when winter tyres cost me no more money (not wearing the summers out and the winters are cheaper anyway) why make things difficult for yourself?

Do you get into the 530 and turn ALL the driver aids off? Thought not, same principle applies.

Why not recommend that when they need to replace the tyres they use the cheapest LingLog far eastern tyres they can buy, surely with your driver training you will not notice ANY difference to a premium tyre anyway and save the tax payer a shed load of money at the same time.

Not everyone has the option to stay at home when the conditions get difficult.

[Fatbloke]

Question: As 'standard' (summer) tyres are known to perform with less than optimal ability in cold conditions and poorly in snowy conditions, would you accept your brakes being seasonal?

Brakes that are rubbish in the snow with summer pads if you could change them for winter pads? A daft hypothetical question maybe, although your brakes are only as good as your tyres can grip!

IMO the most important aspects of car safety are good tyres and brakes. Make them as good/reliable/safe as possible and THEN bring on improved driver training, experience, etc

The majority of drivers have no additional training, drivers with little experience are involved in more incidents and too many of these drivers think they are good at it!

[neil_f]

I believe I am allowed my own opinion, winter tyres would prove no benefit to me at all, I have tried them before and all I felt was more traction at startup but not much on the bends, and as my miles are done on the A9 where you are at a constant speed of around 60mph, I won't be doing much stop starting.

So get off your high horse.

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Yes you are allowed your opinion. Forgot the a9 doesnt get any snow or ice! Winter tyres don't give any more grip on bends.? ?....think tests prove they do unless it is a dry road.

[Moley RUFC]

A simple picture to show the benefits from a good winter tyre. Plenty of strange looks from the 4 x 4 drivers on top of the hill after cruising past wheel spinning idiots trying to go higher.

[Looie]

I got some Goodyear Ultragrip's put on today - been looking for a while after getting stuck on a hill last month (Dec) with no grip whatsoever.......... Decided there and then that winter tyres were the way to go......... but wanted to read tyre threads on this forum before deciding what way to go.........

Previously was in an Impreza STI (for 10 yrs) so had totally forgotten how FWD cars lacked grip in the winter...... Once I had sorted the finances out, the stocks of winter tyres in my local outlets were low (especially now more of the white stuff has arrived), but 24 hrs ordering meant the Goodyear's were waiting for me.

Not done much miles in them yet but going to the tyre place (9am and minus 6 degrees) I was on my "normal" Conti's, and the car was slipping and sliding all over the place - but leaving the tyre place (with the Conti's in the boot to be stored for the winter), I didn't slip, skid or slide once on the trip home, even going up the fairly steep hill out from the tyre place. brilliant!

OK, they cost a fair bit (Fitted them onto the 18" Neptunes), but hopefully they should last three winters so it levels out in the end...

Will be interesting to see how they cope/feel with the same hill I got stuck on last month on Monday when I go to work............

[M12MKD]

I have them, if it keeps me and my passengers safe its worth the money in my book.

[ChrisRs]

My point is that the correct training gives you the skill to control any car safely, irrespective of what tyres are fitted. Spend your cash on yourself rather than your car!

Absolute rubbish!

Do you actually know anything about Winter Tyres?

No amount of training and skill is going to get you up a hill covered in Snow .....even if your name is Timo Makkinen

No amount of training and skill is going to prevent a slide driving down a steep slope covered in snow

No amount of training and skill is going to give you the same stopping distance as winter tyres on a cold wet motorway

No amount of training and skill can compromise road safety to yourself or others can it?

[cjb]

I'm not sure that's the most responsible approach. If all goods vehicles and buses were fitted with winter tyres, then the motorways and town centres wouldnt get gridlocked so easily. No amount of driver skill is going to provide grip where it doesn't exist.

Well, indeed. I've been driving for over 25 years, including a couple of very nasty winters. I never used to have the slightest problem in winter, until I had my Fabia VRS and then the Leon. Both got stuck on winter roads near work, and no amount of careful control would move them because there wasn't enough grip between the wide summer tyres and the road to move well over a ton of car. Literally, the car would not move, no matter how gentle you were with the clutch (for the fabia), or the brakes/throttle (both).

Winter tyres have transformed the Leon. On Friday, I safely overtook several stuck cars and vans. On summers, I'd have been stuck with them.

[Chicane-UK]

Put 16" Michelin Alpin A4's on my Octavia VRS estate and have been chuffed to bits with the results. It was interesting using them for the first time as I didn't know what to expect.. and did find it's easy to provoke wheel spin and ABS panic with too much use of the throttle / brakes but once you know how you should be driving, I couldn't believe how capable the car was. Just fantastic how effortlessly I could get around on some truly dreadful roads.

At one point I had a call from my sister saying "Don't come down my road - it's like an ice skating rink and everyone is getting stuck" - naturally I was quite keen to get down there and went up and down the road several times without a hint of drama.

I'll never ever be without winter tyres for any of my cars ever again. They're magic.

Oh and just to be clear - I'm not an inexperienced driver who needs winter tyres to make him able to drive in poor conditions. I've driven across Europe numerous times, have owned and driven all sorts of FWD and RWD early 90's cars with no traction control in the various winters we've had here throughout the years - I've never had any problems, and only had a few brown trouser moments. But winter tyres change everything

[Dolla]

You can't just put it down to winter tyres alone,although i'm not saying that they don't help in the conditions we've had the last days or during winter time.

If you look at driving on the whole in the UK,people pass a driving test and that's basically it,a few will go on to better themselves with advanced driving courses etc,you can drive on a motorway without having any test or compulsory training after obtaining your full licence,pass plus but that's voluntary.

I think if we continue to get winters like this regular again,then winter tyres will probably become more popular anyway as word of them gets passed around,but you'll get those that will dismiss the idea of having them.

Edited 19 January, 2013 by Dolla

[mat-vrs]

My point is that the correct training gives you the skill to control any car safely, irrespective of what tyres are fitted. Spend your cash on yourself rather than your car!

Given the job you claim to do I am very surprised by your comments.

You are no doubt the type of police driver that give them a bad name. "Holier than thou, better than you lot" attitude.

You may have been through advanced driving courses, but that does not make you immune to the affects of winter.

If you understood the benefits of winter tyres then I am sure you would advocate them as well, along with everyone else here who is doing so.

[domhnall]

Just heard from a friend who's struggling to get up the lane to his house. He has winter tyres but there are 6 4x4s stuck blocking the lane. He's not too impressed. Range rovers mainly apparently

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[Jeeves]

Do you get into the 530 and turn ALL the driver aids off? Thought not, same principle applies.

Why not recommend that when they need to replace the tyres they use the cheapest LingLog far eastern tyres they can buy, surely with your driver training you will not notice ANY difference to a premium tyre anyway and save the tax payer a shed load of money at the same time.

Not everyone has the option to stay at home when the conditions get difficult.

It was the BMW winter driving course I did in Austria that persuaded me of the benefits of winter tyres which I have fitted for the last decade.

Driver training normally gets the driver to try and get more reaction/thinking time. That's exactly what the copper in Wales needed when he found an excuse to breathalise me whilst I was filling up with Optimax (was a few years ago) as he could smell something intoxicating. He hadn't even seen me before, and driving past must have taken exception to my loud coloured car. (Shades of PC Savage vs Winston Kodogo there if anyone remembers that sketch....)

I'm not having a pop at coppers - I have a relative who's one; I just think that common sense should prevail, and it's normally common sense that keeps you safe and on the right side of the law.

[MartynVRS]

Last few stages of the Monte Carlo rally have been cancelled because it's so icy the drivers can't keep it on the road. Obviously all are 4wd and have studded tyres. If they are struggling then I think anyone would

[stever750]

Last few stages of the Monte Carlo rally have been cancelled because it's so icy the drivers can't keep it on the road. Obviously all are 4wd and have studded tyres. If they are struggling then I think anyone would

I'd like to have seen anyone "train" McRae. Maybe that's why he fell off so often, shoulda used PS3s all along RIP

[dunc69]

I have already commented on this thread that the YouTube video comparing summer, all season and winter tyres seemingly ends all argument here.

Today I have seen further proof:

I have had winters on the Octy for a few weeks now. So far they have been very impressive - extremely grippy and surefooted in the cold and wet, and quieter than the summer tyres too. But this afternoon, I saw the huge difference between winters and other tyres.

I went to collect my boy from a birthday party in Clifton, Bristol. I parked on a relatively steep hill on snow / ice. Parked next to me was my friend in his Volvo XC90. When it came to us both leaving with our boys, my friend said, 'It's slippy, would you like me to hang on until you've got away?' I declined (putting faith in the winters with my fingers crossed!).

The Volvo then went into a stationary four wheel spin - which went on and on. Eventually he got his car into the clearer section in the middle of the road and drove away - embarrassed.

I was concerned as to how I would get moving. To my surprise and delight, the Octy pulled slowly away without ANY slip at all. I was staggered. I simply cruised up the hill as if on a totally dry road.

2WD with winter tyres 1 - 0 4WD with normal tyres

HUGE difference. Anyone who thinks winters are pointless hasn't tried them in anger!

[stever750]

But hey folks, one positive here, if traffic boys are clinging on in summers, and you've done your IAM course, then you've got more than half a chance

My tongue is in my cheek, and lots of at metblackrat all meant good humour

[meta55b]

Still never tried my winters for real yet, only driven on a light covering of snow so dont know what they can do yet. compared to the ps3's so far there amazing, but only time and a huge dump of snow will tell. As for fitting winters in the winter, im in.

[mountainandsea]

HUGE difference. Anyone who thinks winters are pointless hasn't tried them in anger!

Lots of sceptics and downright ignorant views about the use of Winter tyres in car forums all the time All I can do is to ask those of you that fall into this category... Have you tried them? Have you driven in snow with them Driven on ice? Driven in heavy rain? No? Then please dont say its down to driving technique or plain bad driving It isnt! I will never go back to normal tyres again in the winter.. They wear very well and even if temperatures go above 7C..They still grip well and dont suffer at all particularly in heavy rain

Hi Chris, Yes, Yes, Yes and Yes. And I still use Vredestein Sportracs. Kind Regards Ian

Hi Duncan,As posted earlier in the thread, I have used winter tyres and then not fitted them subsequently.

To expand on the rather brief reply to ChrisRs above:I fitted winter tyres to a previous car (an A6 Avant) about six winters ago, before they'd become really popular. Given that I live in the area of Britain most affected by winter driving conditions (the CockBridge - Tomintoul road just a few miles away etc) and that I'm in a rural location (2.5 miles to a shop, 20 miles to a supermarket, 26 miles to a dual carriageway and 98 miles to the nearest motorway) I felt that they'd be worth fitting.

The ones fitted were a decent make (Goodyear I think) and in accordance with advice received at the time were inflated very slightly over the normal pressure for the car. Fitted right before the winter hit hard, they were good in really marginal conditions and continued to be so when a thaw came a couple of weeks later. However, on dry or damp roads the tyres adversely affected the handling of the car when cornering. It became "sketchy" and I found myself tiptoeing around corners despite trying different pressures etc.Then the winter weather came back and I left them on - they coped well. Back to better conditions and the handling was awful again.

I was then recommended to fit Vredestein tyres, and the difference was instant. Handling much improved and when a further bout of bad weather came I left these on and found them comparable to the winter tyres.The Audi was sold and the winter wheels went with it. I then bought a Octavia 4 x 4 and have always fitted Vredesteins; normally Sportracs. Even during winter 2010-2011 which was one of the hardest in memory, the car didn't put a foot wrong with these fitted and I've not subsequently fitted winters. I have however passed several cars with winter tyres fitted who were struggling!

Winter tyres pointless? Not at all, and if they work for you and give an advantage that's great. They just didn't work well enough over the range of conditions I needed them to do. For me, and for where I live a good "all season" tyre works.

the 4x4 has recently been traded against a 2012 Scout which still has the factory fit Dunlops on it. As I'm away from home at the moment I haven't driven it in full-on winter conditions, if they don't cut it I'll look to replace. If I did purchase winter tyres they'd only be going on immediately prior to the spells of bad weather and coming off straight away once the roads had improved.

This may go against the orthodoxy of this thread, but please don't infer that those who've had a different experience haven't tried!

Kind Regards

Ian

Edited 20 January, 2013 by mountainandsea

[cjb]

I know it's not axactly like for like, but I took the Lupo out this morning to put some fuel in it and check it was running OK, as it gets used quite rarely. It has nearly new mid-range Kumho summer tyres on, and the Leon has Kumho winter tyres that will be replaced after this winter- they have around 3mm of tread left. Don't get me wrong, the Lupo was perfectly driveable with care- there was a light covering of snow on main roads, compacted snow on side roads, but the difference was very, very noticeable. The Lupo is not noted for a huge lump of low-down torque but anything but very light use of the throttle resulted in wheelspin, and braking on the compacted snow gave a good amount of ABS chatter.

[cjb]

However, on dry or damp roads the tyres adversely affected the handling of the car when cornering. It became "sketchy" and I found myself tiptoeing around corners despite trying differnt pressures etc.Then the winter weather came back and I left them on - they coped well. Back to better conditions and the handling was awful again.I was then recommended to fit Vredestein tyres, and the difference was instant.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a complete winter tyres convert, but when the temp is above 7-8 deg I do find my Kumhos are a bit 'squirmy' compared to the Conti SC3 I use in summer. All tyres are of course a compromise, and I will probably try some different winter ones next time. I find that the slight compromise in outright precision on a warmer winter day is easily outweighed by being able to get to work and back in winter.