1.8TSI and 2.0TSI engine failures

[rayx]

Your indie is typical example of a garage idiot ... You can thank him for well done job ...

 

On 13/03/2019 at 19:51, bspman said:

115kish tension failure signs on mine (rattle) - engine hasn't gone bang yet, but it's at a local indy as we speak.

 

On 27/03/2019 at 21:22, bspman said:

Well, Its been at the indy for a while now. On the weekend he called me in to show me the turbo sat on his workbench. The chain tension was checked with a computer so he started fault finding. Replaced an injector seal, cleaned the intake and eventually got to the turbo. The actuator moves but whatever it's connected to is rattling. Boost wasn't being properly regulated.

 

New turbo getting put in a little over a grand later.

 

Really happy with the work he's done and considering not returning to the vw specialist again.

 

[bspman]

Well, finally sorted, no more horrible sounds and it feels a LOT better than before.

Having the battery out for a bit has helped the DSG feel more normal too.

Edited 7 May, 2019 by bspman

[blegton]

On the basis that it's going to cost me 4K to get chain, pistons, con rods fixed, I'm now looking to get a remanufactured engine fitted, which will work out at approx same price and give me more peace of mind (i.e. shouldn't expect something else to go wrong with the engine).

 

I'm looking to get the engine from VEGE https://www.vegeuk.com that was recommended in another thread, as being providers to lease co's and OEM's. They provide 12m warranty with unlimited mileage . Probably not  the cheapest option but hopefullty (one of) the 'safest'..? 

 

And; does anyone have any recommendations for a  garage in the Manchester area that could reliably install the replacement engine? 

 

Thanks a lot.

 

[Babs]

Awesome GTI in Irlam

[Awesam]

I've got a 2009 VRS 2.0 CCZA, the previous owner managed to get a replacement engine from Skoda with the help of dealer. I've had it for about 3 years now and done about 40k miles. Im trying to figure if I may need to replacement the timing chain or is it just a noisey engine? 

I feel like the car is slightly hesitate at starting for 1 sec and found a flat spot between 2500 - 2800 rpm however is it remapped. 

[Babs]

Who did the map?

[Awesam]

On ‎31‎/‎05‎/‎2019 at 23:13, Babs said:

Who did the map?

Ben at Shark Performance did the tuning mods for the car.

I ve come to conclusion now is that the noise is mostly likely the  flywheel as the clutch has started to slip and resides when i dip the clutch pedal.

I think the CCZA is just a noisey engine caused by the tappets.

[Awesam]

On ‎03‎/‎06‎/‎2019 at 10:38, Awesam said:

Ben at Shark Performance did the tuning mods for the car.

I ve come to conclusion now is that the noise is mostly likely the  flywheel as the clutch has started to slip and resides when i dip the clutch pedal.

I think the CCZA is just a noisey engine caused by the tappets.

Turns out that the rattling  is coming from the DMF which wasn't replaced when the performance clutch was put in as it was deemed that it didnt need replacing.

 

[AHolme]

Greetings,

 

Well it's taken a bit of reading to get through this thread, but it's important stuff, along with the oil burner thread, for TSI owners to know about.  I've a 2011 1.8 TSI circa 67,000 miles and don't really expect it to match up to previous vehicles I've had with with 150,000+ miles without significant work re either the 'sudden death' - tensioner or 'slow death' oil/rings, but I generally like the vehicle.

 

Back on Page 44 , In comment 4371967, by Yeti_man, (who sadly doesn't appear to frequent these parts anymore), he floated the idea of an engine swap for other VAG group models: later 2.0 litre, or even the 300psi R lump. Probably worthy of a thread all of its own, but does anyone have any knowledge/experience regarding the technical complexities of such a project? (My days of engine swaps were 30 years ago and obviously no EMU, or software compatibility issues then).

 

If no first hand knowledge any recommendations for information sources for further research?

 

Kind Regards and Thanks in advance.

 

[Ootohere]

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/467662-timing-chain-related-failures

 

[rayx]

EA888 1.8TSI, engine CDAB, 112kW, mileage +200 000km

oil consumption 1 liter per 200km ...

 

[Awesam]

I had a sparkplug fouling last year but no where near as bad as that! 😳

[AHolme]

On 08/06/2019 at 23:11, Skoffski said:

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/467662-timing-chain-related-failures

 

Sorry Skoffski, but not sure if your response (which I think was to my previous post) was as intended.  Can't see the relevance and of course there's no explanation with the link.  A copy and paste error maybe? 

 

Thanks in advance

Edited 19 June, 2019 by AHolme
typo

[Ootohere]

Relevance is,  a member asking for responses, and here is where they might come from, members with Timing chain issues.

[vwfan111]

Hello Skoda community, I might have some good news for you. I know about the piston/rings problems of the 1.8 TSI gen2 engine and there might be a simpler solution when these fail, other than replace all the internals. I have contacted KOLBENSCHMIDT a few months ago looking for a solution to buy a piston+rings kit having the new SLF type oil scraper rings (supposedly the best version), as well as the 21mm piston pin and thus compatible with the factory conrods. Apparently they (also) have kits of pistons+rings in this configuration, made under the ET Engineteam brand. Here are some examples:

 

https://www.ksmotorshop.com/article-detail/view/en/125551
https://www.ksmotorshop.com/article-detail/view/en/125553

 

The catch is that at the time I spoke to them, several months ago, they did not have them for all diameters (stock and oversize). Also they had both versions of kits in stock, with SLF rings but also some with the older DSF. They said the newest units were SLF so they expected to receive more of them.

 

If you have the piston/ring problem with this engine and are considering replacing them, I suggest you contact them and ask specifically for a kit of piston+rings with the SLF oil scraper rings and the 21mm piston pin. Since some time has passed since my enquiry you need to check if his version is still in stock/in production. After a few enquiries, I'm sure they will update their database and webpage, since they still have pictures of both versions on the site now. If need be ask them to physically check the stock, to make sure they have the right parts. If they do, then you will have the latest/best ring type and won't need to replace conrods, saving quite a bit on parts and labour. I have since bought a different car, but hopefully this option will offer a cheaper and more reliable solution for those with gen2 engines in all VAG cars.

Edited 25 June, 2019 by vwfan111

[Darkslider]

On 25/06/2019 at 00:50, vwfan111 said:

Hello Skoda community, I might have some good news for you. I know about the piston/rings problems of the 1.8 TSI gen2 engine and there might be a simpler solution when these fail, other than replace all the internals. I have contacted KOLBENSCHMIDT a few months ago looking for a solution to buy a piston+rings kit having the new SLF type oil scraper rings (supposedly the best version), as well as the 21mm piston pin and thus compatible with the factory conrods. Apparently they (also) have kits of pistons+rings in this configuration, made under the ET Engineteam brand. Here are some examples:

 

https://www.ksmotorshop.com/article-detail/view/en/125551
https://www.ksmotorshop.com/article-detail/view/en/125553

 

The catch is that at the time I spoke to them, several months ago, they did not have them for all diameters (stock and oversize). Also they had both versions of kits in stock, with SLF rings but also some with the older DSF. They said the newest units were SLF so they expected to receive more of them.

 

If you have the piston/ring problem with this engine and are considering replacing them, I suggest you contact them and ask specifically for a kit of piston+rings with the SLF oil scraper rings and the 21mm piston pin. Since some time has passed since my enquiry you need to check if his version is still in stock/in production. After a few enquiries, I'm sure they will update their database and webpage, since they still have pictures of both versions on the site now. If need be ask them to physically check the stock, to make sure they have the right parts. If they do, then you will have the latest/best ring type and won't need to replace conrods, saving quite a bit on parts and labour. I have since bought a different car, but hopefully this option will offer a cheaper and more reliable solution for those with gen2 engines in all VAG cars.

 

Are these the same pistons as sold by Eurocarparts? They're both listed as Kolbenschmidt so it's possible?

 

Is piston replacement DIYable on these? I've got a workshop with a vehicle lift and tools. Does anyone know whether the crankshaft can be removed from under the car without removing the engine? 

[clamberer]

Not reporting a failure, quite the opposite in fact! 
I have a Mk2 Octavia 1.8tsi (118kw) 57 plate/2008 so I guess the mk1 EA888.

It has now done over 177,000 miles without the engine turning into a pumpkin - I bought it with 75,000 on the clock about six years ago.  Clutch, rear main oil seal and water pump have been replaced.

Power and efficiency probably aren't quite what they were when I got it, but still decent.  Uses a bit more oil than when new but not much.

Besides regular servicing with the correct oil, which I already do, is there anything I should do or check to keep it going? 
Bearing in mind it is probably worth well under £1000 with that mileage, so not worth pouring £100s into preventative tensioner replacement etc..

Or just enjoy it while it lasts as a car that doesn't owe me anything..

[Darkslider]

If it's the Gen 1 EA888 then as long as you've got the latest timing chain, tensioner and water pump fitted there's no other fundamental issues you need to worry about from what I can work out. 

 

My above car was the Gen 2 engine with blocked oil scraper rings and used a litre of oil in less than 600 miles. Only owned it a month and traded it straight in to wewantanycar at a £600 loss, replaced it with a Vectra at a quarter of the price which is faultless. Last VAG car I'll buy. 

[DC04R]

OK. Sorry for complete noob post, I'm a Honda guy wanting to get a VRS mk2 FL (or a Mk3 if I find some money from somewhere!).

 

Which are the cars/engines to keep tabs on? Is it just a case of tensioner replacement with an updated item? I see Awesome GTi are mentioned above, are they a highly regarded specialist? I'm not far from there.

[Babs]

Tensioner was revised late 2011, so 12-plate cars "should" have the latest one.

[DC04R]

7 hours ago, Babs said:

Tensioner was revised late 2011, so 12-plate cars "should" have the latest one.

 

Cheers. How would you tell?

 

So the pfl mk2 and mk3 both had the tsi but the mk2 fl had the tfsi with a dodgy tensioner? Odd

[Darkslider]

To be honest the TSI engine is best avoided in all guides if you're not 100% sure which generation it is. Even if you get a Gen 1 or 3 which doesn't have the blocked piston ring problem, you've still got to suffer with stretchy timing chains, tensioners that let go with no warning, an appallingly designed water pump crammed into the depths of the engine where it will overheat and need replacing every 20k at £650 (going by my example) poorly designed PCV systems which cover everything in oil and make leaks impossible to find... List goes on.

 

If you're set on an MK2 Octavia turbo get a PFL VRS with the older 2.0 TFSI. You can fit a new cam follower, diverter valve and pcv to that for about £120 all in and you've covered all its common problems at once. They do have a cambelt and chain combo but the belt is a simple one to do for any mechanic, and the chain is much more reliable and isn't likely to let go without warning.

[DC04R]

19 minutes ago, Darkslider said:

To be honest the TSI engine is best avoided in all guides if you're not 100% sure which generation it is. Even if you get a Gen 1 or 3 which doesn't have the blocked piston ring problem, you've still got to suffer with stretchy timing chains, tensioners that let go with no warning, an appallingly designed water pump crammed into the depths of the engine where it will overheat and need replacing every 20k at £650 (going by my example) poorly designed PCV systems which cover everything in oil and make leaks impossible to find... List goes on.

 

If you're set on an MK2 Octavia turbo get a PFL VRS with the older 2.0 TFSI. You can fit a new cam follower, diverter valve and pcv to that for about £120 all in and you've covered all its common problems at once. They do have a cambelt and chain combo but the belt is a simple one to do for any mechanic, and the chain is much more reliable and isn't likely to let go without warning.

 

Wow. Ok. So actually sounds like a Mk2 FL with a tensioner done is the one to go for?

 

Coming from a Honda I really can't be bothered with a headache car, just need 4 doors and something that won't bore me to death when I drive it (and obviously reliability).

 

Cheers for that - so the TSI is the problematic one.

Edited 8 August, 2019 by DC04R
.

[Blueglue]

10 minutes ago, DC04R said:

 

Wow. Ok. So actually sounds like a Mk2 FL with a tensioner done is the one to go for?

 

Coming from a Honda I really can't be bothered with a headache car, just need 4 doors and something that won't make me want to slit my wrists when I drive it (and obviously reliability).

 

Cheers for that - so the TSI is the problematic one.

The main issues the Gen1 TSI from 2009 has can include

Tensioner

Chain stretch

Rear main seal failure

Intake manifold

Piston rings

Pcv failure (which caused rear main seal failure).

Water pump (generally the seal) z but is in the centre of the engine under the intake manifold so a PITA)

 

I had the pcv fail causing the rear main seal to fail and throw oil on the clutch. 

My chain was also stretch but the original tensioner had made it to 100k.

 

If these items have been replaced which youre finding with some of the older ones then you wont have issues. The sad state is that skoda dealers and lots of clueless people still hide behind the camchain and tensioner being a lifetime part.

 

 https://www.shopdap.com/blog/post/vw-audi-20t-tsi-common-problems.html

 

Edited 8 August, 2019 by Blueglue

[DC04R]

6 minutes ago, Blueglue said:

The main issues the Gen1 TSI from 2009 has can include

Tensioner

Chain stretch

Rear main seal failure

Intake manifold

Piston rings

Pcv failure (which caused rear main seal failure).

Water pump (generally the seal) z but is in the centre of the engine under the intake manifold so a PITA)

 

I had the pcv fail causing the rear main seal to fail and throw oil on the clutch. 

My chain was also stretch but the original tensioner had made it to 100k.

 

If these items have been replaced which youre finding with some of the older ones then you wont have issues. The sad state is that skoda dealers and lots of clueless people still hide behind the camchain and tensioner being a lifetime part.

 

 https://www.shopdap.com/blog/post/vw-audi-20t-tsi-common-problems.html

 

 

Thanks.

 

Ok now im lost, haha. 

 

2009 was a fl mk2? Thought all fl mk2 were the better tfsi (just a tensioner to future proof).

What is it exactly i should prefer the car to be? 60/11/12/61 plate mk2? Be weary of pfl mk2 and the mk3 as they have the more problematic tsi?

Edited 8 August, 2019 by DC04R
.