190/300

195/320

Ooooer, look who's being the most pessimistic! I'd be very surprised if it was mapped much beyond 260lb/ft torque due to those pistons and rods but I do like this game. It's more fun when its not your motor! :lol

I reckon it'll be between myself and Wardy on the figures so far.

Are you not starting the bets on what it'll make then?! Everyone played that game when I was awaiting Beti's final mapping...

I'll go with 165bhp and 260lb/ft torque.

Out of interest, why did you go with the 170 turbo over the 140 unit?

It's actualy the CR177, 2 big reasons are it has oval ports making it a bolt on swop (apart from a braided oil line) and its a very quick spooling turbo which should help to minimise loss of low end grunt

I know of two 1.6tdi's (a Golf and a Leon) in Denmark that had the same turbo upgrade, but without as many supported mods, that are running at 188bhp and 340Nm.

I'll be gutted if we're not at least there considering the supporting mods I've put in place, my dream result is 190-200bhp with 360-380Nm

I know of two 1.6tdi's (a Golf and a Leon) in Denmark that had the same turbo upgrade, but without as many supported mods, that are running at 188bhp and 340Nm.

I'll be gutted if we're not at least there considering the supporting mods I've put in place, my dream result is 190-200bhp with 360-380Nm

Interesting. Have you swapped any internal bits then? Which clutch are you going for? I should really have a proper read through this thread I guess...

Having said all that re peak figures, I'd rather loose 20bhp off the top to gain low down driveability ie quick spooling - I guess that's why I questioned the choice of forgoing the 140tdi turbo. So the 177 is the only two,litre turbo with matching ports?

I'll be gutted if we're not at least there considering the supporting mods I've put in place, my dream result is 190-200bhp with 360-380Nm

I'm no good at guessing torque but I expected 190-200 also. It'll do over 220 on a two litre with exhaust and decat.

Interesting. Have you swapped any internal bits then? Which clutch are you going for? I should really have a proper read through this thread I guess...

Having said all that re peak figures, I'd rather loose 20bhp off the top to gain low down driveability ie quick spooling - I guess that's why I questioned the choice of forgoing the 140tdi turbo. So the 177 is the only two,litre turbo with matching ports?

Yep it's the only one offering the straight swop, the cars which have gone before have been running for 7000 and 12000 miles respectively with standard internals, clutch etc. So from conversations I've had there is every indication that the standard kit is up to the job.

I suppose time will tell and if the clutch needs an upgrade then DarkSide have a set up or Sachs performance offer an upgraded version aswell

I'm no good at guessing torque but I expected 190-200 also. It'll do over 220 on a two litre with exhaust and decat.

That's spot on, it's a more than capable turbo and if anyone can pull the potential out the 1.6tdi then I'm confident Ben can, it was always a gamble but tomorrow will tell

I reckon it'll be quite peaky for a diesel but as you say, Ben should be able to do the best job possible. Looking forward to seeing the graphs on this one.

 

Btw - Isn't the stock clutch limit around 310nm (around 230lb/ft) or is that just internet scare mongering?

I reckon it'll be quite peaky for a diesel but as you say, Ben should be able to do the best job possible. Looking forward to seeing the graphs on this one.

Btw - Isn't the stock clutch limit around 310nm (around 230lb/ft) or is that just internet scare mongering?

Not been able to get a diffinitive answer on the clutch but goihg on what other tuners have done there hasn't been any issues as yet.

Here's an example from a tuning house calked VVT in Holland who have quite a few turbo upgrades on 1.6tdi's. This is a 1.6tdi Caddy van wich according to part numbers has the same clutch as the Yeti and is running at 188bhp and 360Nm with no issues

https://www.facebook.com/173573969343298/photos/a.198785213488840.52066.173573969343298/885946408106047/?type=1&theater

I wouldn't worry about the clutch personally.

Shark will map it to suit.

 

If the clutch fails in 6 months because you tear about quite a bit, just change it then.

Think there's a bit of mixing up of torque units....

 

I reckon it'll be quite peaky for a diesel but as you say, Ben should be able to do the best job possible. Looking forward to seeing the graphs on this one.

 

Btw - Isn't the stock clutch limit around 310nm (around 230lb/ft) or is that just internet scare mongering?

 

On the PD engines, it was generally reckoned that 300lbft was the limit. I think as standard, engines like the PD130 made around 230-240lbft. 

Not sure what the clutches on the CR engines will take, but have to say I've not seen much talk of slippage on these. Probably because the CR engines have a much more gradual torque delivery, whereas the PD engines were brutal in their torque delivery at fairly low revs, not very clutch friendly.

As a guide, 300lbft is roughly 400NM.

 

To clarify, my estimate is 195bhp / 320lbft

(duplicate post)

Edited 10 February, 201511 yr by muddyboots

Not been able to get a diffinitive answer on the clutch but goihg on what other tuners have done there hasn't been any issues as yet.

Here's an example from a tuning house calked VVT in Holland who have quite a few turbo upgrades on 1.6tdi's. This is a 1.6tdi Caddy van wich according to part numbers has the same clutch as the Yeti and is running at 188bhp and 360Nm with no issues

https://www.facebook.com/173573969343298/photos/a.198785213488840.52066.173573969343298/885946408106047/?type=1&theatre

 

So is that Caddy using the 177 turbo? If so, yours should be great with Shark on the case - same torque figure as the OE factory fitted turbo at 1500rpm - very impressive imo.

 

There appear to be a few 'experts' on the 1.6tdi tuning forums - saw this one last night and though of you!

 

"FWIW, all the hardware between the 75ps, 90ps and 105ps engines is the same (turbos, injectors, fuel pump, what have you...), it's just the mapping. A competent tuner should be able to get any of these variants to 140+ bhp. Stock turbo is a Garrett GTC1244VZ (which is the same as the one in the Golf 1.6 TDI - so that's not an upgrade), so it runs out of puff at ~150bhp. The turbo from the 2.0 CR engines should fit without a problem as the exhaust ports are the same.

Bear in mind the limit of the stock clutch is ~310NM. Also, the internals don't seem to be as strong as the older 1.4 / 1.9 / 2.0 PD units and the newer 2.0 CR units. No bronze bushings in the pistons and quite weak conrods.

Ash "

 

There always an extra challenge when you are doing something new - whether its sourcing the right parts or just suffering with anxiety during the build process - its all good fun!

As a guide, 300lbft is roughly 400NM.

 

To clarify, my estimate is 195bhp / 320lbft

320lb/ft?! Holy smoke!

 

That's more than my stage 2 1.8TSi with less capacity. Id better watch out for this one!

That's also more than Shark's Stage 1 on the 170 TDI (205BHP & 310lb/ft)! I hope you have set aside a budget for frequent tyre changes

Maybe I'm being optimistic on the torque figures then...

But you never know, after all this isn't just off the shelf Stage 1, it's custom mapping with a different turbo, intercooler and air intake.

Well I'm here at Shark Performance and there's some good and bad news, the main bad is that the car isn't quite finished yet. There has been a string of issues, main one being that the actuator had to swopped over from the 1.6tdi turbo as the ECU just wouldn't work with the one on the CR177 turbo. The other bit is that both front ABS sensors are showing a fault, not a biggy they can just swop the sensors over from my original hubs and all is well.

Now for the good news, Ben has lost 3 days due to the actuator issues and still has it on the Dyno as I type but he's got the Yeti at 180bhp and believes that 200bhp is easily achievable!!

Time is going to be the constraining factor as I have to get back and pick up the kids so a return visit may well be needed. The long and short is that I'll be leaving today with at least 180bhp minimum. I'll let you have the final BHP & Nm figures once Ben is done for today.

Bit of an update, with the DPF in place it's sitting happily at 180bhp & 360Nm, Ben added in more fueling and the DPF did not like it, so the solution is a delete pipe which would allow us to reach the 200bhp.

We are going to run it there for a while and bring the car back in the near future to work on hitting that magic 200bhp but for now I'm a happy bunny.

I'll get a pic of the Dyno up and a little feedback on the driving experience later on

Sounds great.

 

Don't go chasing numbers though.

 

Id love to see the original and big turbo graphs overlaid... starting from zero revs.

Bit of an update, with the DPF in place it's sitting happily at 180bhp & 360Nm, Ben added in more feeling and the DPF did not like it, so the solution is a delete pipe which would allow us to reach the 200bhp.

We are going to run it there for a while and bring the car back in the near future to work on hitting that magic 200bhp but for now I'm a happy bunny.

I'll get a pic of the Dyno up and a little feedback on the driving experience later on

 

Personally I think keeping the DPF is the right call.

Making such a nice new car illegal seems a bit daft to me.

Personally I think keeping the DPF is the right call.

Making such a nice new car illegal seems a bit daft to me.

I'd be happy with a DPF-equipped 170bhp diesel Fabia estate

You're all spot on, I always wanted to keep the DPF and I've not even driven it yet so getting a bit ahead of myself, I'm itching to drive it, they are just swopping out the ABS sensors first