Pleased to have experienced the golden age of motoring

[edbostan]

I read the posts with interest but I have not forgotten my early days of car ownership. I started driving in 1966 when cars rusted after 3 years had carburetors, contact breakers, grease nipples and regular Saturday maintenance to keep them running. I learnt it all from my father who nursed a 1954 Ford Popular and I shadowed him and supported him swearing at the 6V power supply, having to use the starting handle on cold mornings to save the battery, and to remove the sump heater which thinned the treacle-thick oil. My son is the complete opposite who expects the engine to fire at the turn of a key and for the engine management system to keep care of things. Grumbles when the windscreen washer bottle empties and has to find the time to check the dipstick. I have mechanical sympathy on engines to avoid the short run and to push an iced-up car so he can drive unhindered out of the drive. Am I alone in wishing my son could appreciate modern-day motoring with modern engines and luxuries such as a heater or air conditioning which is now the norm. Modern-day youth!!!

Edited 30 December, 2018 by edbostan

[StevesTruck]

I've got to admit, I think I'm of an age that's got the best of both. I was born in 1981, so experienced youth bangernomics with the tail end of old fashioned mechanicals. I know what no PAS or brake servo feels like, and appreciate the knowledge it's given me of understanding how a car's sticking to the road. I spend my early years tinkering about with carbs, distributors, drum brakes, basic diesels, but I'm still young enough to not be scared by the more modern stuff as I'm exposed to it. OBD is just another tool to me, yeah, it can make life a lot easier but don't trust it. 

 

Modern stuff tends to be a different sort of puzzle. On older stuff, once you work out what you need to do, the how to do it is generally fairly straightforward. On modern stuff, the code reader and a bit of research tells you what to do, regardless of how obscure the problem, the puzzle is the how to do it. 

 

I've got a good mix of vehicles to play with. I have an old Honda CG, where the only diagnostic tool you can really use is your ears, but you can do any job with the most basic of tools, all the way through to a modern caddy which you can hardly do anything on without plugging VCDS in.

 

It can be infuritating at times, but I love it. Always a new puzzle to figure out!

[silver1011]

What goes around comes around.

 

You fill his washer bottle, he'll show you how to use a smart phone.

[eccleshill]

This sounds like the Monty Python Yorkshiremen sketch but...

Back in the 80's my old boss gave me the "you've never had it so good" line...

"I had to drive from Scotland to Harrogate in my old MG over Carter Bar in a blizzard. No heater in that! Leaky soft top. Wrapped in blankets and a sheepskin coat. Had to stop every few miles to scrape ice off the windscreen and have a nip from my hip flask. You young uns don't know you're born!"

[KenONeill]

Luxury!! When he repossessed the Stone of Destiny from Westminster Abbey, Ian Hamilton had to stop to scrape ice off the inside of the car windows every few miles. (source being his own published account)

[moley]

Best of all was a car with the wipers that ran on the engine vacuum. There was a knob for adjusting the wiper speed, the fast you went the slower the wipers so you had to turn them up, but when you stopped at a junction the wipers were going ten to the dozen. Drum brakes, steering boxes, skinny crossply tyres, poor performance & poor MPG. As my Grand father used to say 'the good old days, no such thing' 

On the plus side you could usually fix the old motors to get them home, with the modern stuff you're screwed.

[lol-lol]

19 hours ago, edbostan said:

I read the posts with interest but I have not forgotten my early days of car ownership. I started driving in 1966 when cars rusted after 3 years had carburetors, contact breakers, grease nipples and regular Saturday maintenance to keep them running. I learnt it all from my father who nursed a 1954 Ford Popular and I shadowed him and supported him swearing at the 6V power supply, having to use the starting handle on cold mornings to save the battery, and to remove the sump heater which thinned the treacle-thick oil. My son is the complete opposite who expects the engine to fire at the turn of a key and for the engine management system to keep care of things. Grumbles when the windscreen washer bottle empties and has to find the time to check the dipstick. I have mechanical sympathy on engines to avoid the short run and to push an iced-up car so he can drive unhindered out of the drive. Am I alone in wishing my son could appreciate modern-day motoring with modern engines and luxuries such as a heater or air conditioning which is now the norm. Modern-day youth!!!

 

The cars are fab it is much of the road network that is a misery.  Little investment in roads for several decades, half the M6 seems to be road works.

 

Car capable of showing 140 on the clock and one gets done for 80 mph at the bottom of a long hill on a clear A road and the car has ABS,ESP and proximity alert.  Hate driving just about anywhere but the South West of England and rural Wales due to the under investment in the roads.

 

Don't miss the Lucas electric on British bikes and cars.  Thank God for great autos like the DSGs (better than the 3 speed in the Rover SD1s) and one can carry hundreds of albums whilst one trundles along at 30 or 50 mph on the motorways !   

[moley]

2 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

Don't miss the Lucas electric on British bikes and cars.  

Do you remember Wipac?

[lol-lol]

7 minutes ago, moley said:

Do you remember Wipac?

 

Did not come across them, were they mainly for Land Rovers?

 

There were some great British devices like the Boyer Bransden that changed the contact breakers so they were just a timing switch and a little electronic box then did the actual main current for the spark plugs.  Meant the contact breakers did not wear out, timing stayed better and fatter spark.  Great upgrade to the Japanese electrical system.

 

Driving with one or two headlights, 25w dip, 35w main beam, not halogen or anything clever, awful.

 

Triumph overdrive unit until was pretty cool making a 6 or even 8 speed box "over-driving" every gear.

 

Driving at 70 mph in an 850 cc mini, 32 hp I think, screaming at about 5k rev, deafening after an hour or two even with the 12 inch Imp wheels replacing the 10 inch originals and giving a slightly higher gearing.   

[moley]

1 minute ago, lol-lol said:

 

Did not come across them, were they mainly for Land Rovers?

British bikes used them. 

[KenONeill]

@moley @lol-lol My Dad had a Wipac halogen conversion on one of his Cortinas (mk3, with 7" round lamps).

[lol-lol]

7 minutes ago, KenONeill said:

@moley @lol-lol My Dad had a Wipac halogen conversion on one of his Cortinas (mk3, with 7" round lamps).

 

A mate would sometimes carry a 5m candle power diving light if car drivers would not dip their headlights when on the (ex-police) Dunstall Commando or one of the Japanese bikes with those poxy headlights.

[moley]

12 minutes ago, KenONeill said:

@moley @lol-lol My Dad had a Wipac halogen conversion on one of his Cortinas (mk3, with 7" round lamps).

The Wipac headlight on my old BSA was like a glow worm in a beer bottle.

[Richard46]

28 minutes ago, moley said:

The Wipac headlight on my old BSA was like a glow worm in a beer bottle.

 

Which reminds me sometime in the 50's my father bought a 1930s BSA car. I suspect it only had about 10hp when it was new. To this day I am traumatised by memories of 14 hour 'holiday' journeys to Cornwall /Devon in it. I recall with particular fondness those golden times when we had to get out and carry the luggage to get up some west country hills. 

Ah those blue remembered hills

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSA_cars

Edited 31 December, 2018 by Richard46

[lol-lol]

26 minutes ago, moley said:

The Wipac headlight on my old BSA was like a glow worm in a beer bottle.

 

I bought one of the last 350 Enfield Indias, around 2005 I recall, £1,999 new.

Gear change on the right, awful electrics, seems like almost no brakes, engine braking was as good as actual brakes. 

Fantastic MPG, wish I kept it.  

 

Not mine but similar.....

 

Edited 31 December, 2018 by lol-lol

[lol-lol]

3 minutes ago, Richard46 said:

 

Which reminds me sometime in the 50's my father bought a 1930s BSA car. I suspect it had about 10hp when it was new which it was not. I am to this day traumatised by memories of 14 hour 'holiday' journeys to Cornwall /Devon in it. I recall with particular fondness those golden times when we had to get out and carry the luggage to get up some west country hills. 

Ah those blue remembered hills

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSA_cars

 

From Exeter going up Holden or Telegraph hill, would struggle up there and down to second gear and about 30 mph.

 

Now can be doing easily over 70 mph (and much more) in a 1.4 that weighs twice as much. 

 

Cars much safer if not hugely more economical.  

[niceyellow vrs]

For me, modern cars have become too technical and geared towards the increasing laziness of society. I much prefer to actually "drive" a car rather than let the car drive me. Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the comfort and quietness of a modern car on a long journey but I soon get bored. My favourite car that I get to drive is my Dad's 1981 Talbot Sunbeam Lotus, the noise, smells and feelings of the car are an experience every time.

I'm currently sticking with my MK1 Octavia VRS as despite it being nearly 15 years old now it's such a good all round car for me. I find it to be on the point of being modern enough to be comfortable and a pleasant place to be but old enough to still give an exciting driving experience when I want it to be. It's also still from a period where I can fully service and maintain it myself without having to fork out for massive garage bills. I honestly have no idea what I'd replace it with if it ever dies, new cars just don't appeal to me.

[Breezy_Pete]

^ Yep.

My 1991 Mk2 Golf was probably the best car I'll ever own, should never have sold it. Figuring out how that Pierburg carb worked was quite a mission, but somehow so much fun.

 

[J.R.]

19 minutes ago, niceyellow vrs said:

For me, modern cars have become too technical and geared towards the increasing laziness of society. I much prefer to actually "drive" a car rather than let the car drive me. Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the comfort and quietness of a modern car on a long journey but I soon get bored. My favourite car that I get to drive is my Dad's 1981 Talbot Sunbeam Lotus, the noise, smells and feelings of the car are an experience every time.

I'm currently sticking with my MK1 Octavia VRS as despite it being nearly 15 years old now it's such a good all round car for me. I find it to be on the point of being modern enough to be comfortable and a pleasant place to be but old enough to still give an exciting driving experience when I want it to be. It's also still from a period where I can fully service and maintain it myself without having to fork out for massive garage bills. I honestly have no idea what I'd replace it with if it ever dies, new cars just don't appeal to me.

 

A great budget hot hatch the Sunbeam was, the Ti version was also excellent with its twin webers, it was also reassuringly old school compared to the mainstream electronic fuel injected GTis.

 

I retained my MK1 Octavia for the same reasons as yourself, some 7 or 8 years ago I had the job of driving peoples cars through the workshops of our lycée pro through various check up stations to raise money for the telethon, I was completely underimpressed with any of the vehicles which were all much more modern than mine, a totally disconnected cocoon like feeling, they were horrible. Highlight of the day was a bog standard poverty trim level but clearly cherished Renault 5, everything was just so light, precise and direct without any power assistance, especially opening and closing the doors.

 

I have just begrudgingly moved up to an identical spec but much lower mileage MK2 Octavia and whilst it has many features that I like as a drivers car it is a big dissapointment compared to the MK1 and I never want to drive anything newer, next car will be something from 10 years further back.

Edited 31 December, 2018 by J.R.

[silverden]

In another 50 years THESE will be the "Good Old Days" 

[xman]

5 minutes ago, silverden said:

In another 50 years THESE will be the "Good Old Days" 

 

I doubt it.

[P6bJOHN]

I think it is not just the cars, but as Lol-Lol touches on, todays roads are in poor condition and crowded. Modern cars cocoon you and because of this driving skills are dropping, by this I mean reading weather/road/time of year etc, made fluctuations to how you drove. I once attended an accident on a road which was shot ice, the lady who had been aiming the Discovery stuck in a wall got out, fell over, and the said something like,

" It's a four wheel drive, I don't know why it hit the wall, it must be a mechanical fault"

I asked her if she couldn't stand up on the ice, how did she expect her tyres to grip, I think she will still be baffled by the question.

Back in the day the cars were crude and you had to allow for this all the time, steering was usually worn and shook like a wet dog, brakes needed anticipation, heaters, if fitted were poor, (classic Mini's had reverse air con, hot in summer, freezing in winter)

My 74 Mk1 Escort is crude, noisy, but connected to the road, my 92 Mk1 Golf Cabrio auto is quieter, more relaxing to drive, but less connected, my 18 Karoq DSG is very quiet, comfortable, but totally devoid of any character or connection with the road. If I had never driven any other car before the Karoq I wouldn't want to drive the Escort as it feels too much alive, (my wife won't as it's crudity scares her).

When this generation of drivers has been totally electrified, ferried about in driverless pods, they might look back with rose tinted specs to now.

[chimaera]

People complain about new cars being too detached from the road, or of driving standards dropping, yet vehicle technology has significantly reduced the likelihood of collisions and fatalities on the roads (far more so than any speed limit enforcement campaign will ever achieve).*

 

In saying that, it's hard to find a modern car you can really enjoy driving on public roads, they're just too capable. In my Superb, I'm going to run out of nerve long before I ever get near its handling limits on the road. Cars now are engineered to be safe and dependable transport for the general public: as a public good this is necessary and to be welcomed but it means those of us who enjoy the thrill of driving are left feeling short-changed.

 

*I was recently looking at annual road traffic collision data for Ireland spanning the last 18 years and it was interesting to note a big drop between 2007 and 2008: ABS became compulsory on all new cars built from July 2007 and in 2008 Ireland introduced motor tax based on CO2 emissions instead of engine size, which skewed the market over towards new cars over nearly new for a period.

[Ootohere]

^^^ VW were aware that cars were now 'engineered to be safe and dependable transport for the general public'  so must have thought.

Lets make it interesting and build a few lemons again. Make the drivers work at getting those cars safely moving.  Just a few ****e ones will do it.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/446820-15-sel-first-gear-issue

 

[xman]

1 hour ago, Skoffski said:

^^^ VW were aware that cars were now 'engineered to be safe and dependable transport for the general public'  so must have thought.

Lets make it interesting and build a few lemons again. Make the drivers work at getting those cars safely moving.  Just a few ****e ones will do it.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/446820-15-sel-first-gear-issue

 

 

Its the anti fatigue system (AFS)......designed to wake the driver up and increase blood pressure....