8 minutes ago, penguin17 said:

Honestly, I wouldn't unless you can afford/justify spending a few hundred on fuel every month.  When I first started a job with a 90 mile return commute, we had a Mk2 vRS.  I'd start the week with a full tank of fuel and be refuelling on the Thursday.  Whilst I loved the car, it got a bit silly as fuel was costing more than I was paying for the car.  When it started to suffer the dreaded carbon deposits on the injectors I switched to Shell Optimax which was only available at my local services and IIRC, not much cheaper than what supermarket 95 is now, so quite expensive at the time.  Needless to say it took the enjoyment out of the car.  I only do about 8K miles PA at the mo and £90+ every 300-400 miles in the 280 is bad enough 😂 

BUT!  Your low mileage, almost identical to mine, means you are suffering from the "short trips economy" syndrome just as I do. What is it? 6-8miles commute? Exactly the time the engine operates outside the ideal conditions and with much increased consumption. We can't apply those figures proportionally to high mileage cars, not at all.

For someone like @silver1011  who does 20K a year you can bet the majority is done at a steady pace around the speed limit and that's where the car gets impressive, as Shy has shown already, he will be getting 37-40mpg easily.  Clearly that's never going to beat Diesel, but just to set the comparison right      

Maybe with those figures in mind and the price of petrol the difference (still in favor of the Diesel for sure) is more pallatable if you factor in the fact you're driving a more enjoyable car also.

Edited 16 January, 20206 yr by newbie69

17 minutes ago, newbie69 said:

BUT!  Your low mileage, almost identical to mine, means you are suffering from the "short trips economy" syndrome just as I do. What is it? 6-8miles commute? Exactly the time the engine operates outside the ideal conditions and with much increased consumption. We can't apply those figures proportionally to high mileage cars, not at all.

For someone like @silver1011  who does 20K a year you can bet the majority is done at a steady pace around the speed limit and that's where the car gets impressive, as Shy has shown already, he will be getting 37-40mpg easily.  Clearly that's never going to beat Diesel, but just to set the comparison right      

Maybe with those figures in mind and the price of petrol the difference (still in favor of the Diesel for sure) is more pallatable if you factor in the fact you're driving a more enjoyable car also.

I was basing it on my similar (22K miles +) usage in the Octy vRS which would, driven sensibly return as much as what the 272/280 is capable of when also being driven 'conservatively', high 30's MPG.  

 

I did the maths when I first bought a Sportline and went for the 150 TDI as it was easily more affordable for me to run.  I desperately wanted the 280 that was in the showroom but even if I could get a consistent 35mpg out of it I still would have found it quite a bind with regard to fuel costs.  All very subjective though and others may have no issues paying to run one.  I then had a massive change of circumstances and no longer need to commute to work every day so I ended up in a 280 after all.  Ironically, if I had just got the 280 in the first place it would have been a load cheaper Vs cost to change.  Ah well, hindsight eh! 

 

I'm basically in the camp that if you can't afford to service/run/maintain a car then that car/model is just not for you.  I want to enjoy it and maintain it properly without having to feel bitter about what it's costing me.  Like I said above though, all subjective and others just may not care or be more affluent.  It's not for me to judge (but I will!) 😁

Edited 16 January, 20206 yr by penguin17

Thanks guys, fuel economy questions on forums are often problematic as there are so, so many variables.

 

My 62 mile each way commute (124 miles per day) is all 50-80mph along rural roads, fast B-roads and dual carriageways.

 

I am lucky, none of it is stop / start, only a few deserted T-junctions and roundabouts.

 

My diesel E220 E-Class averages 50mpg (calculated manually), consistently, my previous MkII 2.0 TDI CR140 Superb averaged 52mpg.

 

I'm spending £300-£400 per month on fuel I guess.

 

If the 272 was £400-£500 roughly, so say an extra £25 per week then it woukd be worth it.

 

Much more than that and I'd definately feel it in the pocket.

4 minutes ago, penguin17 said:

I was basing it on my similar (22K miles +) usage in the Octy vRS which would, driven sensibly return as much as what the 272/280 is capable of when also being driven 'conservatively', high 30's MPG.  

 

I did the maths when I first bought a Sportline and went for the 150 TDI as it was easily more affordable for me to run.  I desperately wanted the 280 that was in the showroom but even if I could get a consistent 35mpg out of it I still would have found it quite a bind with regard to fuel costs.  All very subjective though and others may have no issues paying to run one.  I then had a massive change of circumstances and no longer need to commute to work every day so I ended up in a 280 after all.  Ironically, if I had just got the 280 in the first place it would have been a load cheaper Vs cost to change.  Ah well, hindsight eh! 

 

I'm basically in the camp that if you can't afford to service/run/maintain a car then that car/model is just not for you.  I want to enjoy it and maintain it properly without having to feel bitter about what it's costing me.  Like I said above though, all subjective and others just may not care or be more affluent.  It's not for me to judge (but I will!) 😁

I was in the same boat as you in 2017, I would have loved a 280 (even a used one) but I couldn't afford to run one with my annual 12,000 miles. However having cashed in a small private pension saved in the 1980/1990 era finally my dream became reality and although the latest dual GPF exhaust mods are not welcome (that's progress for you) I figured the extra gear on the mainly motorway commute would keep fuel consumption sensible, which it has I am nowhere near silver1011 levels of monthly fuel cost. Going forward after many years using Shell V-Power because the garage is on my way home and just 2 miles from my house on the right side (the left of course) I have starting keeping the post codes of all the local Tesco garages so that I can save myself £8 per tank filling the Superb with Momentum instead. When it is remapped in a couple of weeks it will be interesting to see what power it makes on the Tesco stuff as it is completely standard apart from the 99 octane fuel.

Always in for some man math  , so:

# 35-37mpg is definitely possible in the fixed pace, long trip conditions @silver1011  describes. I can confirm it from my long trips also that I can see these numbers if sticking to the limit.

# Going then from 50mpg Diesel vs 35-37mpg Petrol he'd get an economy drop of 25-30%

# For an identical fuel price, his £350 monthly fuel cost would go up to  £437.5 -  £455 (for 37mpg or 35mpg respectively)

# Minimal effect but apply to that the lower price of petrol (Google tells me it's a mere 3.7% cheaper? ) and he's looking at around £420-£436 per month.


All in all £70-£86 more/month than with the Diesel.

Edited 16 January, 20206 yr by newbie69

1 minute ago, shyVRS245 said:

I was in the same boat as you in 2017, I would have loved a 280 (even a used one) but I couldn't afford to run one with my annual 12,000 miles. However having cashed in a small private pension saved in the 1980/1990 era finally my dream became reality and although the latest dual GPF exhaust mods are not welcome (that's progress for you) I figured the extra gear on the mainly motorway commute would keep fuel consumption sensible, which it has I am nowhere near silver1011 levels of monthly fuel cost. Going forward after many years using Shell V-Power because the garage is on my way home and just 2 miles from my house on the right side (the left of course) I have starting keeping the post codes of all the local Tesco garages so that I can save myself £8 per tank filling the Superb with Momentum instead. When it is remapped in a couple of weeks it will be interesting to see what power it makes on the Tesco stuff as it is completely standard apart from the 99 octane fuel.

~300bhp; unmapped on 99 octane is my guess. 

14 minutes ago, silver1011 said:

Thanks guys, fuel economy questions on forums are often problematic as there are so, so many variables.

 

My 62 mile each way commute (124 miles per day) is all 50-80mph along rural roads, fast B-roads and dual carriageways.

 

I am lucky, none of it is stop / start, only a few deserted T-junctions and roundabouts.

 

My diesel E220 E-Class averages 50mpg (calculated manually), consistently, my previous MkII 2.0 TDI CR140 Superb averaged 52mpg.

 

I'm spending £300-£400 per month on fuel I guess.

 

If the 272 was £400-£500 roughly, so say an extra £25 per week then it woukd be worth it.

 

Much more than that and I'd definately feel it in the pocket.

If I did your commute I probably would still be driving my 2016 Superb SE 1.4TSi ACT which always did well over 700 miles per tank (once did 800 miles) with cheap 95 octane Supermarket fuel it averaged 50mpg over 16,000 miles and 16 months. The refinement was excellent, the performance was adequate but I needed one more bit of fun before retirement.

1 minute ago, newbie69 said:

Always in for some man math  , so:

# 35-37mpg is definitely possible in the fixed pace, long trip conditions @silver1011  describes. I can confirm it from my long trips also that I can see these numbers if sticking to the limit.

# Going then from 50mpg Diesel vs 35-37mpg Petrol he'd be looking at an economy drop of around 25-30%

# For an identical fuel price, his £350 monthly fuel cost would go up to  £437.5 -  £455 (for 37mpg or 35mpg respectively)

# Minus effect but apply to that the lower price of petrol (Google tells me it's a mere 3.7% cheaper? ) and he's looking at around £420-£436 per month.


All in all £70-£86 more/month than with the Diesel.

Don't try to prove things with more than respectable maths skills and facts.  This is a forum where we like to argue about points we cannot backup with anything more than conjecture, bigotry and opinion 😁

2 minutes ago, penguin17 said:

~300bhp; unmapped on 99 octane is my guess. 

Well we will find out for sure on 4th February.

2 minutes ago, penguin17 said:

Don't try to prove things with more than respectable maths skills and facts.  This is a forum where we like to argue about points we cannot backup with anything more than conjecture, bigotry and opinion 😁

Penguin are you really Gordon Brown former PM?

Out of interest @newbie69 what is your long term average MPG?  Mine is an indicated 24 MPG, which I believe to be pretty accurate based on earlier tank-to-tank calculations. 

 

I wonder if it is only that 7th gear e.g; at higher loads where the extra efficiency of the 272 comes into its own. 

Edited 16 January, 20206 yr by penguin17

32 minutes ago, shyVRS245 said:

If I did your commute I probably would still be driving my 2016 Superb SE 1.4TSi ACT which always did well over 700 miles per tank (once did 800 miles) with cheap 95 octane Supermarket fuel it averaged 50mpg over 16,000 miles and 16 months. The refinement was excellent, the performance was adequate but I needed one more bit of fun before retirement.

 

I'm pretty sure that is the same engine in our Kodiaq, and whilst in the Kodiaq and with the wife's journey types it is no where near as efficient, it was the smoothness, quietness, ease of driving, instant heat, no DPF, EGR etc. that made me consider a petrol for my commute.

 

I can concur, the little 1.4 TSI is a peach of an engine. I've never driven a 272 but I'm hoping a lot of the same traits are carried through.

37 minutes ago, newbie69 said:

All in all £70-£86 more/month than with the Diesel.

 

Nice and simple man-maths, we all love that!

 

Thank you for this.

 

It really does show that the necessity to drive a diesel if doing over 12,000 miles (is this still the recommended mileage?) annually is dated.

 

£20 a week to move from a diesel to a petrol, and not just any petrol, the awesome 272? How things change!

I do find it quite interesting reading about what other people class as good and bad fuel economy. 

 

Surely you don't buy a sporty model and expect great fuel economy? 

 

I'm happy if my st hits 27mpg on a long run, I magneto just under 27 a few weeks ago on an 350 mile motorway run. This also required 2 stops at shell, first one when I set off and the second time 260 miles later after the fuel light came on. 

Straight onto Autotrader for a snoop...

 

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?sort=price-asc&postcode=sl13yd&radius=1500&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly New&onesearchad=New&make=SKODA&model=SUPERB&fuel-type=Petrol&minimum-badge-engine-size=2.0&maximum-badge-engine-size=2.0&keywords=272

 

Alas, the cheapest are still holding good money. This is the lowest priced one on at the minute...

 

11 minutes ago, penguin17 said:

Out of interest @newbie69 what is your long term average MPG?  Mine is an indicated 24 MPG, which I believe to be pretty accurate based on earlier tank-to-tank calculations. 

 

I wonder if it is only that 7th gear e.g; at higher loads where the extra efficiency of the 272 comes into its own. 

Just throwing my thoughts in when I collected my car the previous owner (SKODA UK Milton Keynes) had averaged 32.5mpg long term, which I have now improved to just over 33mpg in less than 3 weeks. 70mph in 7th gear is 2,000rpm on the motorway.

5 minutes ago, caprixpack said:

I do find it quite interesting reading about what other people class as good and bad fuel economy. 

 

Surely you don't buy a sporty model and expect great fuel economy? 

 

I'm happy if my st hits 27mpg on a long run, I magneto just under 27 a few weeks ago on an 350 mile motorway run. This also required 2 stops at shell, first one when I set off and the second time 260 miles later after the fuel light came on. 

My previous car a 336bhp Octavia Vrs245 averaged 440 miles per 50 litre tank with a best of 526miles on a long motorway run so 27mpg is quite shocking to me but the 2.3litre Ford engine is known to be noisy (in a good way if you like that sort of thing) and thirsty so no surprises really.

1 minute ago, caprixpack said:

Surely you don't buy a sporty model and expect great fuel economy? 

 

Why not?

 

Having a sporty car that can achieve reasonable fuel economy when not being driven in a sporty fashion i.e. 95% of the time, but can set off like a scolded cat on the odd occasion (traffic and mood allowing), is the ultimate package, surely?

 

Sure, it is a trade-off, but it is often assumed that you have to either have maximum fuel economy OR maximum performance, when in fact there are multiple points along the scale. I'd happily sacrifice some fuel economy for some more performance, but I don't want to drive on the edge of the cars limit all the time.

 

My own personal circumstances mean it isn't outright performance either, petrol engines, especially VAG's TSI petrol engines are very good.

 

Also, this is a Superb, not a Mazda MX-5. The Superb will never be a 'sporty' car, the Superb in 272 guise is still a comfy cruiser but with the hidden ability to put many more expensive 'sports cars' to shame.

8 minutes ago, silver1011 said:

Straight onto Autotrader for a snoop...

 

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?sort=price-asc&postcode=sl13yd&radius=1500&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly New&onesearchad=New&make=SKODA&model=SUPERB&fuel-type=Petrol&minimum-badge-engine-size=2.0&maximum-badge-engine-size=2.0&keywords=272

 

Alas, the cheapest are still holding good money. This is the lowest priced one on at the minute...

 

Very similar car to mine. Paid £23,840 with 4,900 miles on the clock. Go for it you know you want it.

It's not the ford 2.3, if it were it would be in the mid 30s. Mine is the older mk2 st with the 2.5 volvo engine. The 27 is on a run, day to day running its around 22 mpg and will drop into single digits if I'm having some fun. I went for the mk2 as I love the sound of the 5 cylinder engine, it was initially supposed the be a weekend fun car but I found myself using it as my daily. 

15 minutes ago, caprixpack said:

It's not the ford 2.3, if it were it would be in the mid 30s. Mine is the older mk2 st with the 2.5 volvo engine. The 27 is on a run, day to day running its around 22 mpg and will drop into single digits if I'm having some fun. I went for the mk2 as I love the sound of the 5 cylinder engine, it was initially supposed the be a weekend fun car but I found myself using it as my daily. 

 

I remember when the Mk2 ST first came out , I read an article on the 5 pot Volvo engine holding up development/production as the Ford engineers weren't impressed with the sound it made.   It all worked out in the end though.  Great cars the Mk2 ST.  A friend had a ST2, in orange and it absolutely embarrassed my Mk2 vRS in the driving stakes, steering feel was just lurvely. 

52 minutes ago, penguin17 said:

Out of interest @newbie69 what is your long term average MPG?  Mine is an indicated 24 MPG, which I believe to be pretty accurate based on earlier tank-to-tank calculations. 

 

I wonder if it is only that 7th gear e.g; at higher loads where the extra efficiency of the 272 comes into its own. 

I have 26mpg over the last 2200 miles as you can see in the screenshot.  Mind you my commute is just 4 miles though, 7 if I take the long way (more rarely), so even worse conditions than yours iirc.

Edited 16 January, 20206 yr by newbie69

@penguin17  @newbie69 , those are my consumptions, I don't have long term average. But, trust me, it isn't much better  

 

When i made my choice i was expecting something like this fuel consumptions... and i have to say it's worth it!

10 minutes ago, Roscio said:

@penguin17  @newbie69 , those are my consumptions, I don't have long term average. But, trust me, it isn't much better  

 

When i made my choice i was expecting something like this fuel consumptions... and i have to say it's worth it!

That's definitely city traffic isn't it?  Mine drops to those numbers too when I have the great (!) idea of taking it downtown for errands in the week-end...

not entirely. say half city traffic and half suburban roads and highway.

Speed limits tells how fast (or slow) you do have to drive, but not in how much time you can reach those speeds